What will stop you from owning the new Z?

[takemorepills]

After viewing the car yesterday (not able to sit in it however), I am left with two concerns. The first is outward visibility. Toronto-area traffic is a zoo these days, so this is getting to be more important to me, and while the new Z is generally no worse than the 370 in this respect that car was very marginal. I think I will have to find a used Z on some dealer lot to sit in again to assess whether I can live with it.

The second issue also relates to traffic and the areas I drive most frequently - is the Z just too much car for it? There are very very few opportunities to "let her rip" around here unless you are out at 2 am or want to drive an hour out of the city. And even my 8 second to sixty current car can get going smartly off the line, it only feels a bit sluggish on the highway. Would I be able to use enough of the capacity of a 4.3 second car to make it worthwhile taking on the extra cost, etc.? Possibly the considerably cheaper twins with their 6 second time and better outward visibility is a more appropriate choice, even though it is nowhere near as well styled, won't sound as good, and lacks the rev-matching MT I want. Going to sit in a new GR86 today at the dealership to check it out.

I have a Q60, same chassis, same forward sightlines. No problem here. Mustang and Camaro that I have rented before are ridiculously bad.

My buddy has one of them 3 sec. Teslas, and it's fine in dense traffic. I agree though, my wife's new Corolla hatchback with the 2.0 is more than enough in Seattle traffic, rarely get above 2500 rpms with it.

 

[indio22]

After viewing the car yesterday (not able to sit in it however), I am left with two concerns. The first is outward visibility. Toronto-area traffic is a zoo these days, so this is getting to be more important to me, and while the new Z is generally no worse than the 370 in this respect that car was very marginal. I think I will have to find a used Z on some dealer lot to sit in again to assess whether I can live with it.

The second issue also relates to traffic and the areas I drive most frequently - is the Z just too much car for it? There are very very few opportunities to "let her rip" around here unless you are out at 2 am or want to drive an hour out of the city. And even my 8 second to sixty current car can get going smartly off the line, it only feels a bit sluggish on the highway. Would I be able to use enough of the capacity of a 4.3 second car to make it worthwhile taking on the extra cost, etc.? Possibly the considerably cheaper twins with their 6 second time and better outward visibility is a more appropriate choice, even though it is nowhere near as well styled, won't sound as good, and lacks the rev-matching MT I want. Going to sit in a new GR86 today at the dealership to check it out.

The lack of visibility on many newer vehicles, due to raised beltlines, lower canopies and obstructions, is a gripe of mine. No wonder rear view cameras are needed these days, when a driver can hardly see out the back windows.

Hoping the new Z has decent visibility with the low (at least in the photos) canopy . When driving my BRZ (first gen), I can generally see what's going on around me fairly well. Hoping the new Z doesn't have that "driving a tank" feeling when looking out the windows.

 

[takemorepills]

The lack of visibility on many newer vehicles, due to raised beltlines, lower canopies and obstructions, is a gripe of mine. No wonder rear view cameras are needed these days, when a driver can hardly see out the back windows.

Hoping the new Z has decent visibility with the low (at least in the photos) canopy . When driving my BRZ (first gen), I can generally see what's going on around me fairly well. Hoping the new Z doesn't have that "driving a tank" feeling when looking out the windows.

Yesterday was a windows down day in my Q60.
The door/window sill is just a touch too tall to feel comfortable resting my arm on top of the door with the window open. I miss my old Hondas from the 80's and 90's. But still, it's not as bad as many other cars with the window sill seemingly at your cheek.

However, it's no where as bad as most modern sporty cars. You can't really rest your arm on the window sill of the Camaro. And it's uncomfortable in the Challenger also.

 

[Haste]

Yesterday was a windows down day in my Q60.
The door/window sill is just a touch too tall to feel comfortable resting my arm on top of the door with the window open. I miss my old Hondas from the 80's and 90's. But still, it's not as bad as many other cars with the window sill seemingly at your cheek.

However, it's no where as bad as most modern sporty cars. You can't really rest your arm on the window sill of the Camaro. And it's uncomfortable in the Challenger also.

Can your seat move any further up (not forward)? I prefer the seat bottom angled back but the actual seat is raised up making for a really natural position to rest my arm. Visibility is better and how in control I feel outweighs any performance benefit of sitting lower on the street.

I don't think I've ever owned a car where I couldn't rest my arm comfortably on the door. 2.5RS Coupe was probably the worst, but that would be a deal-breaker as much as I roll with the windows down. Never been an issue with my Z's.

 

[fliplover]

Can your seat move any further up (not forward)? I prefer the seat bottom angled back but the actual seat is raised up making for a really natural position to rest my arm. Visibility is better and how in control I feel outweighs any performance benefit of sitting lower on the street.

I don't think I've ever owned a car where I couldn't rest my arm comfortably on the door. 2.5RS Coupe was probably the worst, but that would be a deal-breaker as much as I roll with the windows down. Never been an issue with my Z's.

I sat in the new Z when it was at Z1 Motorsports. I was able to comfortably rest my arm on the sill. The sight lines weren't great, but definitely better than my stepson's 2015 Camaro.

 

[FBD]

I just checked out a few POV 370Z driving videos where I could see where the camera was mounted on the drivers' foreheads, and that has somewhat alleviated my concern about the forward sightlines. I wasn't so much concerned about seeing the road, it was the claustrophobic effect of having a very low roofline, the resulting low windshield cuts off all your view of the sky which I hate. The Camaro is terrible for this, I could not even see the traffic lights when right at the front of an intersection.

Have you never owned a Z before? Your concerns are true of just about every dedicated sports car. And to be honest it is one of the reasons why 6 of my last cars (including two Z's) were roadsters you could put the roof down. No better feeling. But when the roofs had to stay up (read here even WORSE visibility) I got used to it. The best car ever hands down (and I've been watching reviews and have been tempted to get another one) was my 300ZX with T-tops. It was a total glass roof experience from the windshield to the back hatch. My 370Z Stillen Roadster did not have a back up camera and you just get used to it. Part of the trade off of a dedicated sports car. The twins will be more livable. But at what cost.

 

[FBD]

After viewing the car yesterday (not able to sit in it however), I am left with two concerns. The first is outward visibility. Toronto-area traffic is a zoo these days, so this is getting to be more important to me, and while the new Z is generally no worse than the 370 in this respect that car was very marginal. I think I will have to find a used Z on some dealer lot to sit in again to assess whether I can live with it.

The second issue also relates to traffic and the areas I drive most frequently - is the Z just too much car for it? There are very very few opportunities to "let her rip" around here unless you are out at 2 am or want to drive an hour out of the city. And even my 8 second to sixty current car can get going smartly off the line, it only feels a bit sluggish on the highway. Would I be able to use enough of the capacity of a 4.3 second car to make it worthwhile taking on the extra cost, etc.? Possibly the considerably cheaper twins with their 6 second time and better outward visibility is a more appropriate choice, even though it is nowhere near as well styled, won't sound as good, and lacks the rev-matching MT I want. Going to sit in a new GR86 today at the dealership to check it out.

One more thought that your post made me think of...for me the trade off will be the extra ease and access and livability of the hatch. It is not much but a massive improvement over "trunks" found in roadsters. You'll have to be smart but there is more luggage capacity for two to run away for the weekend.

 

[Houston.RZ34]

At this point, the only thing keeping me out of this car is greedy dealership shenanigans.

 

[BobDigi5060]

The GR86.

 

[FBD]

The GR86.

Given the impending bidding war in the US (and who knows what the sticker will be in Canada) at what point does it make sense to stick with a 370Z and throw some bolt ons or a stillen package? I had already sold my 370Z Roadster otherwise I'd be keeping it and not looking at the 2023 at all, however seduced I am by the retro good looks and mech LSD. If the price becomes so high that it makes other cars possible Nissan could have a problem.

 

[DevonK]

Interesting. Please keep us updated on your thought process.

I was able to sit in a neighbour's 370Z right before I drove to the Toyota dealership today to see the GR86 so there was only about a 15 minute gap between sitting in both, allowing for a good comparison of the outward visibility. There is no doubt that the Z has a narrower back window, but to the side and front I was surprised to find that the two were roughly equivalent in that regard. Based on photos I had thought the GR86 had a taller windshield or lower cowl than it does. Both cars seem marginal to me in terms of outward sightlines but I am coming from a car with a tall windshield and low cowl. I'm sure I could adapt, neither are anywhere near as bad as a Camaro.

More generally, compared to the new Z I saw yesterday, I'd say the GR86 looks very good on its own but the Z is in a different class, more upscale and substantial. The GR86 interior. while improved over the previous gen with supportive and attractive seats and a more integrated and stylish dash/door card setup, is not in the same league as the Z's. The clutch was fine, but the shifter was very notchy and took a lot of force to shift - maybe that loosens up when the car is warm? Steering wheel is very nice looking but the buttons on it feel cheap. The IP is kind of weird - Toyota did not use a one-piece display panel but went with 2 displays of different types side by side, it looks very discount and reeks of cost-cutting.

I came away thinking I'd rather have the Z, but the GR86 seems a fine car on its own given the price. It kind of looks like the love child issuing from a hookup between the new Z and a hardtop Miata....

 

[TaroBaapG35]

I was able to sit in a neighbour's 370Z right before I drove to the Toyota dealership today to see the GR86 so there was only about a 15 minute gap between sitting in both, allowing for a good comparison of the outward visibility. There is no doubt that the Z has a narrower back window, but to the side and front I was surprised to find that the two were roughly equivalent in that regard. Based on photos I had thought the GR86 had a taller windshield or lower cowl than it does. Both cars seem marginal to me in terms of outward sightlines but I am coming from a car with a tall windshield and low cowl. I'm sure I could adapt, neither are anywhere near as bad as a Camaro.

More generally, compared to the new Z I saw yesterday, I'd say the GR86 looks very good on its own but the Z is in a different class, more upscale and substantial. The GR86 interior. while improved over the previous gen with supportive and attractive seats and a more integrated and stylish dash/door card setup, is not in the same league as the Z's. The clutch was fine, but the shifter was very notchy and took a lot of force to shift - maybe that loosens up when the car is warm? Steering wheel is very nice looking but the buttons on it feel cheap. The IP is kind of weird - Toyota did not use a one-piece display panel but went with 2 displays of different types side by side, it looks very discount and reeks of cost-cutting.

I came away thinking I'd rather have the Z, but the GR86 seems a fine car on its own given the price. It kind of looks like the love child issuing from a hookup between the new Z and a hardtop Miata....

GR86 makes you "work" to get to speed, hence the fun nature of it, same as a miata..But to your point, and one my own reasons why I'm shooting for the Z and not GR86 is the overall package factor...The 370z was more comfortable, quieter and obviously faster and sounds better (to me) vs my brother's 1st gen BRZ. We were both lowered, and modded (intake, exhaust, wheels/tires, Tune), so pretty close in terms of apples to apples comparison. My brother prefers the lightness of the brz vs the comfort/heft of the Z.

Plus the cost cutting/cheap(er) interior and depreciation of the brz swayed me away from it as well. I think the z is the perfect sweet spot between brz/supra.

 

[Denver the Last Dinosaur]

Your concerns are true of just about every dedicated sports car.

I guess that depends on what you class as a "dedicated sports car". It tends to be true of the 2-seaters, but the 2+2 coupes usually feel more roomy inside simply due to that extra room behind your back.

I've had the rear seats down in my 200SX hatchback and it's virtually a wagon ... a couple of times I've transported loads of computer equipment, one time it even included a large CRT display, a flat-pack desk, and a chair. The large expanse of glass on the boot/trunk also helps it feel more roomy (in the front seats anyway), although it also means a lot of heat during summer and a lot of weight when lift the lid.

 

[Denton]

• Bad reviews (inc. performance)
• To high of a cost
• Supply

In that order. Although somewhere about 20 miles above the points above is whether I'll be allowed to by the missus

 

[94boosted]

• Bad reviews from the auto journalists that can actually drive i.e. Randy Pobst
• MSRP
• Lack of front camber adjustment