jezzza

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Sep 2, 2021
Threads
48
Messages
1,030
Reaction score
2,244
Location
Australia
Car(s)
Ranger Raptor
Occupation
‎‎ Engineer
the z will be astronomical once dealerships add adm
I'm not in the US but it seems average ADM is around 10%, our extra taxes in Australia amount to more. At least with ADM the market decides what's appropriate while here the government has us by the balls.
 

Z hope

Well-Known Member
First Name
Bob
Joined
Apr 28, 2022
Threads
0
Messages
82
Reaction score
139
Location
ShadowZ
Car(s)
Acura
Occupation
Retired
TBH these prices are pretty normal for Aus ( although car mats are a bit over priced)
Guys I think we have to stop living in the 80s, with the way the economy is going at present we are going to be in a world of pain for quite a few years to come.
Pandemic, war always equals depression.

In Aus at the moment we have a running commentary on the price of lettuce..in many states it’s $6 plus for a lettuce that cost us $1.50 8 months ago.

Not trying to justify Nissans prices, just saying, this is what’s coming in every aspect of our lives
Your right. We can All thank our government for this shit show. The real payback is to the people that voted for it. At least in the U.S .
 

jdm-rhd

Well-Known Member
First Name
rob
Joined
Jun 26, 2021
Threads
69
Messages
2,740
Reaction score
6,199
Location
orbiting caprica
Car(s)
95 hardtop supra, 93 widebody rx7, 93 stockish rx7
Occupation
videogame tester/skater
in this article @takemorepills posted, shows how much new cars have risen. that 5k would have made a big difference.

Soaring prices.
The average listing price in May rose 12% from a year to $45,495: for non-luxury vehicles to $42,240; and for luxury vehicles, to $64,282, according to Cox Automotive data. The year-over-year increase in listing prices has been roughly in the 12% range since last summer, and roughly in line with the CPI for New Vehicles.

This means that the average new vehicle has gotten nearly $5,000 more expensive over the past 12 months, which is another indication that there is large demand amid complicated and shifting new vehicle shortages.
 

RicerX

Well-Known Member
First Name
Z
Joined
Sep 14, 2020
Threads
3
Messages
314
Reaction score
810
Location
Limbo
Car(s)
2020 Titan Pro4X
in this article @takemorepills posted, shows how much new cars have risen. that 5k would have made a big difference.
This is the core truth of all of it.

New vehicle launches have carried unprecedented ADM over the last year. The Z will be no exception - the difference will be the duration of the high demand to enable these ADMs. The Corvettes started tapering off a bit just in time for the Z06s to launch. Broncos are still sky high. A baseline Bronco that's actually on a lot in my area is $80k.

Think about this - that "average car pricing" statistic basically says that for every $20k Corolla you see, there is someone buying a $71,000 truck or SUV. (Can you get a Corolla for $20k anymore? idk.) This is staggering. That's for REGULAR cars. We're not talking about BMWs and Porsches at that figure.

Five years ago, my father-in-law bought a (very lightly used) 911 Turbo for $71,000. That car commands six figures now. That market is pure buffoonery at the moment. We're seeing $200k Corvette Z06s - cars that are generally worth 40% of MSRP in 6 years.

People financing regular cars are going to be SO FREAKIN SCREWED when the bottom falls out (and it will - get ready for the flood of repossessed cars to hit the used car lots and tank the used car market). All of that is coming.

We're griping now, but I'm very suspicious that within three years these Z cars will be priced right where everyone wants them... one way or another.
 

indio22

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2021
Threads
2
Messages
494
Reaction score
1,060
Location
Chicagoland
Car(s)
'72 Rover S3, '85 CJ7, '98 TJ, '14 BRZ, '23 Bronco
This is the core truth of all of it.

New vehicle launches have carried unprecedented ADM over the last year. The Z will be no exception - the difference will be the duration of the high demand to enable these ADMs. The Corvettes started tapering off a bit just in time for the Z06s to launch. Broncos are still sky high. A baseline Bronco that's actually on a lot in my area is $80k.

Think about this - that "average car pricing" statistic basically says that for every $20k Corolla you see, there is someone buying a $71,000 truck or SUV. (Can you get a Corolla for $20k anymore? idk.) This is staggering. That's for REGULAR cars. We're not talking about BMWs and Porsches at that figure.

Five years ago, my father-in-law bought a (very lightly used) 911 Turbo for $71,000. That car commands six figures now. That market is pure buffoonery at the moment. We're seeing $200k Corvette Z06s - cars that are generally worth 40% of MSRP in 6 years.

People financing regular cars are going to be SO FREAKIN SCREWED when the bottom falls out (and it will - get ready for the flood of repossessed cars to hit the used car lots and tank the used car market). All of that is coming.

We're griping now, but I'm very suspicious that within three years these Z cars will be priced right where everyone wants them... one way or another.
Part of that will depend on future vehicle scarcity. I've read some articles claiming automakers desire to maintain a certain level of scarcity going forward, meaning they would like to produced fewer vehicles, regardless of when commodity constraints clear up.

If automakers can hold the line on scarcity, they can keep the prices higher in the future. Even though yes, some foolish persons now who payed way to much, will be in trouble regardless.

An article about it: https://www.businessinsider.com/will-car-prices-drop-back-to-normal-or-stay-high-2022-5
 

trackratZ

Well-Known Member
First Name
August
Joined
Mar 23, 2021
Threads
62
Messages
1,861
Reaction score
4,166
Location
So CA
Car(s)
240Z RB26DETT,Glady Rubi, Model Y LR, 987 Cayman S
Occupation
Software security
Part of that will depend on future vehicle scarcity. I've read some articles claiming automakers desire to maintain a certain level of scarcity going forward, meaning they would like to produced fewer vehicles, regardless of when commodity constraints clear up.

If automakers can hold the line on scarcity, they can keep the prices higher in the future. Even though yes, some foolish persons now who payed way to much, will be in trouble regardless.

An article about it: https://www.businessinsider.com/will-car-prices-drop-back-to-normal-or-stay-high-2022-5
Figure at least for these first allotments thru 2023, we all will be lucky to drive off the lot any Z Performance for under $60K and Sport for under $50K USD. Foreign markets who knows. Hope I'm overexaggerating but probably sad truth!
 

RicerX

Well-Known Member
First Name
Z
Joined
Sep 14, 2020
Threads
3
Messages
314
Reaction score
810
Location
Limbo
Car(s)
2020 Titan Pro4X
Part of that will depend on future vehicle scarcity. I've read some articles claiming automakers desire to maintain a certain level of scarcity going forward, meaning they would like to produced fewer vehicles, regardless of when commodity constraints clear up.

If automakers can hold the line on scarcity, they can keep the prices higher in the future. Even though yes, some foolish persons now who payed way to much, will be in trouble regardless.

An article about it: https://www.businessinsider.com/will-car-prices-drop-back-to-normal-or-stay-high-2022-5
So this, in a vacuum, I agree with. Why this isn't a guarantee is all of the other economic forces at work in the near term.

When the pandemic started and before shortages were fully realized, the automakers panicked that people wouldn't buy cars, and I got my 2020 Titan for $10k off sticker PLUS 0% for 84 months, so I bought something I wasn't planning on buying at the time. That same truck two years later is offered with no discounts and 5% for 72 months financing at my local dealer.

Currently, the average car loan is sitting around 5% for 60 months from a bank. A touch better with a credit union. This is all increasing as frequently as a week-to-week basis. 0% notes are mostly gone, with some regional exceptions. Couple that with mortgage rates going through the roof, we're on the verge of another real estate collapse when those with ARMs get popped soon, among other scenarios. You also have many people like myself that advanced a car purchase during the pandemic that now won't buy in 23 or 24 like originally planned. When you have those elements in play, the demand for cars in general will heavily tank within the next year, two years max.

When that happens, it doesn't matter how scarce the inventory is - manufacturers will go back to cash-on-hood incentives and financing incentives where they can. Even if they don't, per the CEO of Ford in that article, one dealer network will get desperate enough to make numbers, or one manufacturer not as cashflow-endowed like Ford or Toyota will get desperate and offer some conquest incentives that will force the rest of the industry to compete. Over the last year, there hasn't been much competition - buyers are showing up in droves to overpay for cars they want. That won't sustain - it can't.
 

takemorepills

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 15, 2021
Threads
15
Messages
2,393
Reaction score
5,167
Location
Seattle area
Car(s)
Q60
So this, in a vacuum, I agree with. Why this isn't a guarantee is all of the other economic forces at work in the near term.

When the pandemic started and before shortages were fully realized, the automakers panicked that people wouldn't buy cars, and I got my 2020 Titan for $10k off sticker PLUS 0% for 84 months, so I bought something I wasn't planning on buying at the time. That same truck two years later is offered with no discounts and 5% for 72 months financing at my local dealer.

Currently, the average car loan is sitting around 5% for 60 months from a bank. A touch better with a credit union. This is all increasing as frequently as a week-to-week basis. 0% notes are mostly gone, with some regional exceptions. Couple that with mortgage rates going through the roof, we're on the verge of another real estate collapse when those with ARMs get popped soon, among other scenarios. You also have many people like myself that advanced a car purchase during the pandemic that now won't buy in 23 or 24 like originally planned. When you have those elements in play, the demand for cars in general will heavily tank within the next year, two years max.

When that happens, it doesn't matter how scarce the inventory is - manufacturers will go back to cash-on-hood incentives and financing incentives where they can. Even if they don't, per the CEO of Ford in that article, one dealer network will get desperate enough to make numbers, or one manufacturer not as cashflow-endowed like Ford or Toyota will get desperate and offer some conquest incentives that will force the rest of the industry to compete. Over the last year, there hasn't been much competition - buyers are showing up in droves to overpay for cars they want. That won't sustain - it can't.
I'd love to think your assessment is correct.

However, I'm seeing some discouraging things happening. My son is going to need a car in 18 months, and I too was hopeful that maybe things will turn around and go "back to normal". However, although the correction may just be getting started, I looked to see what the used car situation is like, and it's pretty bad at the moment.

I thought maybe we just need to give the turn around more time to occur. However, I also found out that insurance companies are totalling out otherwise easily fixed vehicles because repair parts are very hard to get. This is one of many pressures that will keep all vehicles too expensive for a few more years. These insurance customers are getting minor repairs totalled out, then either hitting the new or used market for an ever dwindling supply of vehicles.

You gotta look at the totality of the situation, not just one layer of vehicle sales.
 

Houston.RZ34

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 25, 2021
Threads
8
Messages
926
Reaction score
2,522
Location
Texas, USA
Car(s)
15 Q50 S (3.7) 23 Stingray HTC
Occupation
CIO
In Aus at the moment we have a running commentary on the price of lettuce..in many states it’s $6 plus for a lettuce that cost us $1.50 8 months ago.

Not trying to justify Nissans prices, just saying, this is what’s coming in every aspect of our lives
$6 for some Iceburg?!

So this, in a vacuum, I agree with. Why this isn't a guarantee is all of the other economic forces at work in the near term.

When the pandemic started and before shortages were fully realized, the automakers panicked that people wouldn't buy cars, and I got my 2020 Titan for $10k off sticker PLUS 0% for 84 months, so I bought something I wasn't planning on buying at the time. That same truck two years later is offered with no discounts and 5% for 72 months financing at my local dealer.

Currently, the average car loan is sitting around 5% for 60 months from a bank. A touch better with a credit union. This is all increasing as frequently as a week-to-week basis. 0% notes are mostly gone, with some regional exceptions. Couple that with mortgage rates going through the roof, we're on the verge of another real estate collapse when those with ARMs get popped soon, among other scenarios. You also have many people like myself that advanced a car purchase during the pandemic that now won't buy in 23 or 24 like originally planned. When you have those elements in play, the demand for cars in general will heavily tank within the next year, two years max.

When that happens, it doesn't matter how scarce the inventory is - manufacturers will go back to cash-on-hood incentives and financing incentives where they can. Even if they don't, per the CEO of Ford in that article, one dealer network will get desperate enough to make numbers, or one manufacturer not as cashflow-endowed like Ford or Toyota will get desperate and offer some conquest incentives that will force the rest of the industry to compete. Over the last year, there hasn't been much competition - buyers are showing up in droves to overpay for cars they want. That won't sustain - it can't.
I can confirm, the housing market is starting to cool down (in Houston at least) - It's summer (the hottest time to sell 'cuz school year) and houses are starting to sit for up to a month or more now.

Once gas went up, everything else paused.

There's even been some talk of transitioning from a lot full of inventory to having a few demos and then ordering.
This is absolutely correct but, that gives folks enough time to change their minds - it's always best to strike while the iron is hot when selling "big" stuff (cars, houses, etc)
 
Last edited:

West Aussie

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2021
Threads
8
Messages
3,612
Reaction score
5,758
Location
Australia
Car(s)
Hyundai I20
$6 for some Iceburg?!
Yep….and people are snapping the stems off broccoli and the like to bring the weight down at the checkout, because the fresh fruit and veg prices have skyrocket.
I saw a punnet of strawberries last week for $12 ….they use to be $2.50 in Jan

I kid you not
 

Houston.RZ34

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 25, 2021
Threads
8
Messages
926
Reaction score
2,522
Location
Texas, USA
Car(s)
15 Q50 S (3.7) 23 Stingray HTC
Occupation
CIO
Yep….and people are snapping the stems off broccoli and the like to bring the weight down at the checkout, because the fresh fruit and veg prices have skyrocket.
I saw a punnet of strawberries last week for $12 ….they use to be $2.50 in Jan

I kid you not
We'd be throwing a fit by now.
 

Raven1

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 11, 2022
Threads
1
Messages
253
Reaction score
583
Location
Phoenix
Car(s)
2007 350z HR Motor
Occupation
503rd Lead Farmer
Who Knew All Of Our Accountant Members Were So Gangster !!!

A1ED7D28-540B-47F4-9D60-437F548000D6.gif
 

Blackbeard

Well-Known Member
First Name
Anthony
Joined
Dec 3, 2021
Threads
0
Messages
673
Reaction score
1,143
Location
mia
Car(s)
22 Supra
Occupation
Mechanic
i bet this shit shows up to the dealer with all the boxes check marked lol
 
 





Top