My patience just ran out.

[takemorepills]

This video compares an open vs LSD diff. Notice with the LSD, the application of throttle causes the tail to slide out more, with greater likelihood of swapping ends. Where as with the open diff, the driver was having trouble getting the tail to break loose. Something to consider in terms of normal road driving, slick surfaces and maintaining control.

Thank you!

This is what I meant.

Open diff is safer in certain conditions because primarily one wheel peels and the other one maintains some lateral traction. This also happens earlier, at lower limits and allows traction control to intervene sooner when it's safer for the average driver.

With LSD, if you are on a crowned road, or have lateral loading on a wet/slippery surface, both wheels will peel giving you nearly zero lateral traction. Ends will swap. And the new VR has more than enough power to spin both wheels.

Where the LSD is beneficial is for competent drivers, in the dry it gives far better traction from a stop, or coming out of a turn, and the oversteer that may happen is generally controllable and fun in the dry.

Also, in some cases, LSD is nice in bad weather, if you are a competent driver, you can rely on 2 wheels trying to get traction.

However, never is LSD "safer". If both back wheels break loose, unexpectedly, on slippery surface with a crown, your headed for the curb. If it happens mid-turn/corner, you're swapping ends.

I had a HLSD Trutrac installed on my truck. It's freaking dangerous in the wet, and I won't let my wife or son drive it on a slippery day. But it's awesome off-road and doesn't do one-wheel-peel anymore.

 

[ZDreamer]

I've seen some predictions to this effect, as well.

Interest rates have definitely not hit their ceiling yet and most projections have the peak coinciding with the beginning of at least a mild recession. Ironically, many also predict that next spring/summer is when supply chain issues will start to abate, which will cause a flood of vehicles to hit dealerships...just in time for nobody to be buying.

Might be perfect timing I guess. Right now, I'm waiting until December 2023, after my car note, for a Nissan Z Sport MT. Hopefully, it will be $43K OTD (to replace my current monthly payment)

Can't justify for a 3.0 Supra MT ($15K more), but right now the Supra appears to be more affordable (w/ all of the crazy ADM) than the Z.

 

[Blackbeard]

Please explain to me how one wheel peel is more dangerous than 2 wheel peel.
I'm ready to be enlightened by your expert take on the matter....

im not sure if this is a serious question but without a lsd when u apply power the power only goes to one wheel which in turn could make u slide more to right or left depending , in a lsd power is applied equally to both rear wheels.. never mind i took to long to write this lol

 

[Kbl911]

However, never is LSD "safer". If both back wheels break loose, unexpectedly, on slippery surface with a crown, your headed for the curb. If it happens mid-turn/corner, you're swapping ends.

I had a HLSD Trutrac installed on my truck. It's freaking dangerous in the wet, and I won't let my wife or son drive it on a slippery day. But it's awesome off-road and doesn't do one-wheel-peel anymore.

It's a bit more nuanced than you're making it, though. Another part of the equation is the stability and traction management systems built into the vehicles. Generally speaking, these will augment the behavior of the LSD and provide an additional safety net since ESC systems can manipulate braking action to further try to equalize the power between wheels and prevent a spin-out.

Anecdotally, I have never had a vehicle (RWD, specifically) with LSD squirm unpredictably in wet conditions at freeway speeds under steady throttle (this is with an ESC system engaged), yet I have absolutely had an open diff behave that way. Very unnerving, obviously. Thus, I would personally conclude that the open diff is less safe in inclement weather, excepting perhaps snow/ice, which is not a consideration for me.

 

[takemorepills]

It's a bit more nuanced than you're making it, though. Another part of the equation is the stability and traction management systems built into the vehicles. Generally speaking, these will augment the behavior of the LSD and provide an additional safety net since ESC systems can manipulate braking action to further try to equalize the power between wheels and prevent a spin-out.

Anecdotally, I have never had a vehicle (RWD, specifically) with LSD squirm unpredictably in wet conditions at freeway speeds under steady throttle (this is with an ESC system engaged), yet I have absolutely had an open diff behave that way. Very unnerving, obviously. Thus, I would personally conclude that the open diff is less safe in inclement weather, excepting perhaps snow/ice, which is not a consideration for me.

My truck doesn't have any traction or stability control. The difference between LSD and open is represented without being clouded with traction aids.

If the truck had modern traction aids, I would bet it'd be perfectly safe with either diff type. Then we'd just be discussing the obvious benefits of LSD.

My point is it's ridiculous to say open diff is dangerous or less safe than LSD. That's not true, and an open diff vehicle getting squirrelly at highway speeds sounds like something other than a diff issue

 

[takemorepills]

im not sure if this is a serious question but without a lsd when u apply power the power only goes to one wheel which in turn could make u slide more to right or left depending , in a lsd power is applied equally to both rear wheels.. never mind i took to long to write this lol

Sorry, but you should research more about how diffs apply power and how traction loss occurs with different types of differentials.

I'm starting to feel like I'm talking to a wall here.

Again, I am only talking about the 2 previous assertions that open diff is somehow unsafe. When people don't understand, they seem to double and triple down on their assumptions.

 

[Kbl911]

My truck doesn't have any traction or stability control. The difference between LSD and open is represented without being clouded with traction aids.

If the truck had modern traction aids, I would bet it'd be perfectly safe with either diff type. Then we'd just be discussing the obvious benefits of LSD.

My point is it's ridiculous to say open diff is dangerous or less safe than LSD. That's not true, and an open diff vehicle getting squirrelly at highway speeds sounds like something other than a diff issue

Oh, wow, that must be an older vehicle. My point there was to say that an LSD in wet conditions versus an open differential in those same conditions still has the advantages inherent in the LSD and that there are other systems that would potentially stop either one from spinning out or flying into a curb (in any US -market vehicle produced after 2012, I believe), so that's a little dramatic. I can see that wasn't entirely clear, now that I look at it.

Open diffs are not inherently unsafe. That's obviously not true; they're far too common for that to be even remotely the case. But if we add in significant power and a classic FL downpour, the LSD will have advantages over an open setup, just by design.

You know, I thought the squirmy behavior was strange, too! But no issues with the vehicle were identified upon inspection. Not even the tires or alignment. It was not a terribly uncommon experience but it was a frightening one. Just spinning the one tire in the rain on the freeway - good times!

 

[takemorepills]

Yup, 2007 Titan VK56DE, lots of torque and very sketchy in the rain. Also the throttle on these trucks is a bit too aggressive exaggerating the issue.

Newer vehicles are much better.

 

[Houston.RZ34]

With open diff, just let go of the gas.

As for prices, since everything else seems to "outshine" the Z......demand will be low and sales will be slow.

I can't wait to see how they end up after the bubble pops. I was able to get away with a 2010 40th Anniversary that had 27k miles on the clock for a whopping $21,000 back in 2014.

350s and 370s deprecated, hard.

 

[Blackbeard]

Sorry, but you should research more about how diffs apply power and how traction loss occurs with different types of differentials.

I'm starting to feel like I'm talking to a wall here.

Again, I am only talking about the 2 previous assertions that open diff is somehow unsafe. When people don't understand, they seem to double and triple down on their assumptions.

Ok guys pack it up he has spoken, master tech doesnt know shit , end of thread

 

[Kbl911]

With open diff, just let go of the gas.

As for prices, since everything else seems to "outshine" the Z......demand will be low and sales will be slow.

I can't wait to see how they end up after the bubble pops. I was able to get away with a 2010 40th Anniversary that had 27k miles on the clock for a whopping $21,000 back in 2014.

350s and 370s deprecated, hard.

Totally - the 350s were hit particularly harshly by that depreciation. 370s have maintained their value better (particularly post-facelift models with average-to-low milage) but that may be soon to taper off.

I am super interested to see how the initial sales for the new vehicle go and if the combination of lukewarm test results/reviews and the hilariously sloppy rollout have an impact on the prices of the early Zs in a few years. Nissan may find themselves struggling to move units after the initial flurry, and even that might be a shorter window than normal.

 

[Houston.RZ34]

Totally - the 350s were hit particularly harshly by that depreciation. 370s have maintained their value better (particularly post-facelift models with average-to-low milage) but that may be soon to taper off.

I am super interested to see how the initial sales for the new vehicle go and if the combination of lukewarm test results/reviews and the hilariously sloppy rollout have an impact on the prices of the early Zs in a few years. Nissan may find themselves struggling to move units after the initial flurry, and even that might be a shorter window than normal.

I somewhat disagree, the 09-12s fell really hard IMO. My 40th fell ~50% in just 3 years.

But, I do agree those DRLs must be made of platinum and Diamond because the 13+ seemed to hold value for a good little bit and never really dipped too under 20k and anything 15+ held value because they hardly made any 370s at that point.

Funny part is, there were 0 major changes from 2009-2020 - it's the same damned car.

Yeah, yeah......12 had the oil cooler (lol) and 13 brought the "refresh" and added Bose to the Nismo as an option, 15+ had the Nismo v2 and they added an Auto option. I think in 2018 they made bluetooth standard, took away the fender turn signals and included a trunk popper button.

 

[Kbl911]

I somewhat disagree, the 09-12s fell really hard IMO. My 40th fell ~50% in just 3 years.

Right, there's the caveat of the post-facelift models bringing up the averages, and that's partially just because they are newer vehicles. It's coming, though.

 

[takemorepills]

Ok guys pack it up he has spoken, master tech doesnt know shit , end of thread

Say what?

 

[MHockey17]

Funny part is, there were 0 major changes from 2009-2020 - it's the same damned car.

Yeah, yeah......12 had the oil cooler (lol) and 13 brought the "refresh" and added Bose to the Nismo as an option, 15+ had the Nismo v2 and they added an Auto option. I think in 2018 they made bluetooth standard, took away the fender turn signals and included a trunk popper button.

‘18+ also added Dunlops derived from the GTR and an Exedy clutch which is (allegedly) a vast improvement over the original setup; Not major changes by any means, but would sway me to the late model 370Zs if I was shopping for one.

As a side note: the fact it took Nissan till 2018 to add a way to pop the hatch from inside is kind of ridiculous. Alternatively they should’ve just sold Zs with the 4-button fob that includes a trunk button, since it’s already an electronic release.