General Ask a Nissan Salesman Thread

[FBD]

I feel perhaps you're overestimating the attention span, and underestimating the general apathy of the average consumer. We're enthusiasts who frequent a message board, so we don't fall into that category, but I think overall people will forget.

Was sounding like a altruist and optimist there for a second. Yeah, you are right. Thankfully, I did not blindly trust just any old dealership with my purchase but a corp connection to secure my allocation. Still, I will not pay any top ups or extortion tactics to gross up my purchase price. BUT, I would happily pay to have them throw some exhaust on the manual and a few other things of my choosing if that helps them. The whole point to all of this is let the CUSTOMER choose. Then you've got a recurring source of sales.

 

[FBD]

Again, not a Canadian law expert, but it wouldn't surprise me if those tactics aren't totally legal in Canada.

I have seen this mentioned many times on Tundra forums. There was one guy who pulled up "used 2022 Tundra" on cars.com and found 187 of them for sale. How the heck is a brand-new, can't keep them on the lot, super popular truck available as "used" so soon after initial release?

I've taken your cue and have emailed my dealer to see if they've heard of this. I should qualify that my contact formerly worked for my corp for the same team where I am now and so I'll get the straight goods hopefully. It will be a dark day if Canada starts mirroring the underhanded approach of the ADM's south of the border.

 

[takemorepills]

Subscriber Identification Module = Chip. It is the SIM card in cell phones and vehicles. The supply chain has been massively disrupted with most SIMs coming from China. Manufacturers are trying to pivot and are currently building other manufacturing sites they deem are more secure in other parts of the world. But that will be another 18-24 months at least. Tesla's for example can take up to 4 SIMs. We are at everyone's mercy. Until we get a handle on the SIM problem manufacturing the Z would only result in a bunch of Zs sitting in a parking lot without the chip. yeah yeah...we already all know all of this...

I used to work in the semiconductor industry. SIM cards are only needed for telematics and some smartphones and laptops.
I googled "sim shortage" to avoid looking like an idiot, and nothing came up.

Cars have lots of small microprocessors, power controllers, voltage regulator, LED drivers, bus drivers for CANBUS, power MOSFETs etc, all of that is what's holding up manufacturing, not SIMs.

 

[takemorepills]

I've taken your cue and have emailed my dealer to see if they've heard of this. I should qualify that my contact formerly worked for my corp for the same team where I am now and so I'll get the straight goods hopefully. It will be a dark day if Canada starts mirroring the underhanded approach of the ADM's south of the border.

Doesn't matter where you are, half of the world wakes up trying to figure out how to screw over the other half. Tactics change, but assholes are the same.

 

[FBD]

I used to work in the semiconductor industry. SIM cards are only needed for telematics and some smartphones and laptops.
I googled "sim shortage" to avoid looking like an idiot, and nothing came up.

Cars have lots of small microprocessors, power controllers, voltage regulator, LED drivers, bus drivers for CANBUS, power MOSFETs etc, all of that is what's holding up manufacturing, not SIMs.

Sorry brother. Not true. We (unnamed obviously) just signed a massive SIM deal with one of the biggest automakers in the world. There are a variety of SIMs all coming down the the semi-conductor shortage. ESIMS and ISIMs and these are embedded in the telematics devices these days. In some cases the "SIM" is now only some soldering on the motherboard in a SIM/Telematics device. And if we had a lot of these things we'd have more cars right now. But you are right these other components are contributing too. The semi-conductor shortage is so acute manufacturing plants are moving to more secure locations where we can control our supply chain. Now if you can imagine all this...how are we supposed to continually come up with all that lithium for these EV cars?

Here is an overview just at a glance. Hopefully second half of 2022 will see better supply chain:

https://www.reuters.com/business/au...semiconductor-shortage-will-abate-2022-02-04/

 

[takemorepills]

Sorry brother. Not true. We (unnamed obviously) just signed a massive SIM deal with one of the biggest automakers in the world. There are a variety of SIMs all coming down the the semi-conductor shortage. ESIMS and ISIMs and these are embedded in the telematics devices these days. In some cases the "SIM" is now only some soldering on the motherboard in a SIM/Telematics device. And if we had a lot of these things we'd have more cars right now. But you are right these other components are contributing too. The semi-conductor shortage is so acute manufacturing plants are moving to more secure locations where we can control our supply chain. Now if you can imagine all this...how are we supposed to continually come up with all that lithium for these EV cars?

Here is an overview just at a glance. Hopefully second half of 2022 will see better supply chain:

https://www.reuters.com/business/au...semiconductor-shortage-will-abate-2022-02-04/

Ah, gotcha.

Fuck telematics, I disconnect that shit in my Mk7 GTI and my wife's new Corolla hatchback. I don't need my car connected to shit.

BTW, VW is saying "not until 2024"
https://www.carscoops.com/2022/04/vw-says-semiconductor-shortage-wont-be-fixed-until-2024/

 

[FBD]

Ah, gotcha.

Fuck telematics, I disconnect that shit in my Mk7 GTI and my wife's new Corolla hatchback. I don't need my car connected to shit.

BTW, VW is saying "not until 2024"
https://www.carscoops.com/2022/04/vw-says-semiconductor-shortage-wont-be-fixed-until-2024/

I completely agree with you on the "connected" car thing. Hate it. Trying to disconnect as much as possible. I actually switched completely to Vinyl two years ago so I don't have to experience my phone interruptions and be reminded of work while my music streams. In fact, I would pay extra for a completely analogue car with hydraulic steering and no connection at all.

 

[H2O_Doc]

The ADM's are pure greed. And any salesman masking as an enthusiast supporting ADM's are complicit in that greed. The real rub is stealerships will have the upper hand now because of short supply. But once the supply chain and the SIM shortage ends and starts flowing, anyone who extorted customers "just because they could" will reap the consequences of their behaviour. No one will return to a sales person who took advantage of them in a pandemic economy.

And yes...I get the capitalist freedom argument. It is actually why Canada has prevented ADM's. The market, if left to itself, will do exactly what it is doing to all of you in the US in this current use case of ADM's. It's just wrong.

We sold my wife’s year old Mercedes for more tha we paid for it and above MSRP. Was that wrong?

 

[FBD]

We sold my wife’s year old Mercedes for more tha we paid for it and above MSRP. Was that wrong?

I wouldn't think so at all. An "old" Mercedes has had the benefit of inflation doing the heavy lifting with your current sales price vs. the original sales price. That is completely different than a dealer tacking on outrageous markups during a historic pandemic economy fraught with difficulty, or driving a new car for 800kms and turning it into a used car in Canada to get around the prohibited ADMs up here. THAT is pure usury and greed. Your sale of a used car is just the natural appreciation on a sold asset that you purchased and enjoyed over the years. However, if you had a dealer allocation of a C8 Corvette that you bought personally and got it in Canada at MRSP (I'm using a real example local to me now) and bought it for 98K and put it on Autotrader for 149K then that is usury and extortion. Having said that, it is not a cancer treatment as was mentioned and is a completely luxury and elective purchase and if someone wants to cave in and make that purchase decision it is on them. But it is different from your case. And when you instituionalise it across all dealerships it is the reason why Canada views that as a form of extortion and prohibits ADMs.

 

[FBD]

Again, not a Canadian law expert, but it wouldn't surprise me if those tactics aren't totally legal in Canada.

I have seen this mentioned many times on Tundra forums. There was one guy who pulled up "used 2022 Tundra" on cars.com and found 187 of them for sale. How the heck is a brand-new, can't keep them on the lot, super popular truck available as "used" so soon after initial release?

Ok I've just heard back from my Canadian dealer. Obviously removed all personal identifiers and markers. Here is my email followed by their response:

My email:

Happy Monday. Quick question that I'm hearing from other dealerships and wanted to know your practices over at XXXXXXX. I am hearing of ways dealerships are using to jack up prices on cars like:
a dealership might say "there is no ADM, but the truck comes equipped with our dealer packages pre-installed for $3,995" and I read up on the packages:
-nitrogen
-windshield treatment (WTF?)
-some weird brand I had never heard of for interior and exterior treatment
-tire and wheel guarantee for 1 year

Or:
Dealer drives the car for 1200Km and its now a used car you can slap an ADM (Added Dealer Markup?) which is illegal here in Canada.

Not worried just curious. I've never heard of these kinds of things with reputable dealers but reports from Ontario are coming in that this is what is happening with the Titan. If anyone drove a new Z or added after market stuff my guess is you'd be in for a tough sell on a spec ordered customer car? We are getting closer to launch so time for some questions. Also, do you have any real visibility on the number of allocations you guys will get sent? You've said that I am #3. Just curious how many people ended up on your list. I think you said 10 on the first day...

Dealership response:

Unfortunately due to the current inventory situation more and more dealers are starting to mark up their in stock vehicles above MSRP, XXXXXXXX and our management team feel this practice is short sighted and is not ethical and have committed only to sell our vehicles at the MSRP with no mark ups. Anything additional that a customer wishes to purchase are optional and will be up to the customer to decide if they require it or not.

Have a wonderful day!

Cheers!

NOTE: The comment was on marking up "stock" vehicles. Which is still not allowed here in Canada but I think this is hinting at the shady practice of making a new stock car "used" and then marking it up?

 

[West Aussie]

I've taken your cue and have emailed my dealer to see if they've heard of this. I should qualify that my contact formerly worked for my corp for the same team where I am now and so I'll get the straight goods hopefully. It will be a dark day if Canada starts mirroring the underhanded approach of the ADM's south of the border.

I don’t see how this would affect you….you have signed a contract for a new car….therefore they can’t legally take it for a spin then mark up…again the contact is for new not used

 

[FBD]

i agree but canada has its own issues. currently dealers are getting around this in canada by allowing the manager to drive the truck a few hundred or thousand K and selling the truck as used. look at all the New frontiers in ontario and most are being sold with 900-1700km on them to get around the laws. they even send the truck to another sister dealer to be sold on their lot as used for a higher mark up.

I have taken your comments to heart and found a couple of examples of this in Ontario and Canada (posted here elsewhere). The task now remains to completely call out and name these dealerships and sales professionals (sic) and boycott them. Thankfully in Canada they will hopefully be the minority. But they need to unashamedly hear from us Canadian customers now so they know our loyalties will go elsewhere and they can be stuck with their superfluous addons while they try to con a few honest people into an illegal and rejigged ADM prohibited in Canada.

 

[FBD]

I don’t see how this would affect you….you have signed a contract for a new car….therefore they can’t legally take it for a spin then mark up…again the contact is for new not used

I don't have a signed contract. Only a dealer allocation. I have the official order confirmed email (as opposed to reservation) but my dealer (who isn't adding on ADMs or addons) won't in good faith generate a contract without a VIN, MSRP price and delivery date. What would the contract be holding me to in effect? But you are right, no one would mess with an ordered car. Only a car that is in stock and sitting on the lot.

 

[takemorepills]

I don't have a signed contract. Only a dealer allocation. I have the official order confirmed email (as opposed to reservation) but my dealer (who isn't adding on ADMs or addons) won't in good faith generate a contract without a VIN, MSRP price and delivery date. What would the contract be holding me to in effect? But you are right, no one would mess with an ordered car. Only a car that is in stock and sitting on the lot.

I know I keep bringing up the Tundra, but in USA orders for Tundra take a long time to fill, and are probably not preferred by the dealership, however they are getting a surprising number of Tundras on the lot. I think they prefer the ones on the lot over the ordered ones as they can tack on add-ons. My local Toyota dealership has Tundras for rent.... wanna guess why? Because they become used. I looked on cars.com and there's more used 2022 Tundra than new.

These dealers suck, they've figured out 20 different ways to bend us over

 

[McLovin157]

Yeah wtf. McLovin you’re losing any credit you got. Keep in mind your cred started at negative being a salesman. The irony of your post. Unbelievable.

I am happy to state that working with me would be purchasing a Z at a maximum of 5k over MSRP. I don't own the dealership and thus I don't get to make executive decisions when it comes to pricing. I also encourage that if you find someone to work with who will see you a Z at MSRP to please do so. I can't. The dealer group had a meeting discussing the Z starting at a mark up of 10-15k with production numbers looking bleak.

I did not come in here promising the lowest price but I did promise honesty.