AT vs MT confusion

[RobotAZ]

I'll be 49 for 4 more months, and I can truthfully say that's not old.
I mean, I feel old on the inside the vast majority of the time. And I'm starting to look pretty old on the outside. But I'm sticking to my guns; 49 isn't old. 50, on the other hand...

All said and done, I'd still swap my AT for an MT if I could snap my fingers and make it so. If they bring in an MT for '26 and don't ruin anything else, I may have to make a financially uncomfortable decision. I've driven a manual since I started driving, other than the quick-ish stint in a 2005 Touring Z33. A lot of people don't understand (or process correctly) the mechanical connection and feeling of control you get from a manual. They always default to the 'I don't want to have to constantly shift in traffic' excuse. To me, driving a manual is just as simple and brainless as driving an automatic. My left leg and right arm are moving a little more, but it's purely natural at this point, almost no conscious thought/effort involved...daily driving anyway.

That's specifically why I don't like EVs. Regardless of how "quick" or "fast" or "agile" a car is, you should be as connected as possible and in full control when driving a car, and especially a sports car.

Unfortunately, I say this as a 2024 NISMO owner. I'm like the fat guy that doesn't exercise preaching to others about losing weight.

Oh well. No one's perfect.

I’m 52 and started my day running 10 miles through the woods in 1:15. It’s all relative. Theres not a pathetic fatass kid in my county that can outrun me regardless of age. It’s in the mind, not the body. Ask Goggins who’s running bone on bone and smoking basically everybody at 50

 

[Mr. Mac]

The manual to me feels like an old grandma car. Maybe that’s what they were thinking. Regardless, complaining changes nothing.

lol at recognizing “complaining changes nothing” while complaining that “The manual to me feels like an old grandma car.”

 

[FSUZ33]

Someone...PLEASE!...figure out how to install this in my Z so it reacts with RPM and gear shifts. There's a crisp $5 bill on the line if you can make it happen!



BONUS POINTS AVAILABLE if you can figure out a way to wirelessly hack into and upload this into EVs in traffic that play fake exhaust noises outside the car (the new Charger EV, etc...).

 

[5thZ]

OP's question about the #2 statement is so outrageously wrong it's hilarious. The MT in the 370Z can easily handle 700tq and hp (just get yourself an external CSC).

The MT for the Nissan Z has been improved with external CSC. You want capability to control 1000ftlb 1000hp in a manual Z? Great, upgrade the clutch. You're done.


Lastly, BMW's statement that their MT's can't handle what, was it, 500HP, is not saying MT's in general can't handle that power. It's stating that BMW is flat-out admitting they suck at MT's and they're using 20-30 year old MT designs but trying to spin it that only AT's in general can handle the "power" lol

I chose a Nissan Z over a BMW M2 Comp because the M2 Comp felt soul-less. While I could definitely tell the M2 Comp had electric power steering, it's not as a numbing sensation on the Nissan Z, and in fact, I couldn't tell at first that it was electric power steering.

 

[alienpoker]

Having moved from a 370Z 6sp MT Nismo to a Z Nismo, I have a few comments. I still own both BTW so feel fairly confident in my comparison:

1. At this point arguably Nissan is a failing company but with decent engineering (as long as they stay away from CVT ). So they made a good fiscal decision *at this point* to offer the Nismo AT only. Not for the Z enthusiasts, but for the company.

2. The 6mt was crap anyway:

• I had to change the clutch spring to get the “bite” to feel right on the 370Z and it became more drivable.
• The Rev Match isn’t usable imho- it just burns fuel and doesn’t really work. A joke.
• I still shudder every time I shift from 1st to 2nd at high revs in the 370Z Nismo. There’s a ‘click’ that shouldn’t exist, and yes I even had the sychro replaced and changed trans oil at 50K to try and cure it. Anyone who drives MT a lot agreed it’s ’Notchy’. The Master Tech who drove mine hard said it’s normal. Yeah, Uh, no it’s not. You are almost forced to double clutch. OK-they *have* changed to external Clutch Slave (finally) on the Z, so you don’t have to pay for CSC delete.
• Search ‘rev hang’ in the forum and read the thread(s). It’s a noticeable thing that probably will always exist because of emission controls built in to the ECU. It’s making throttle decisions for you- so how does that fit in with “the 6MT is a driver’s car”? Compared to driving modern MT performance cars Nissan’s current Z 6MT leaves *a lot* to be desired.

3. I nearly bought the Orange Heratige Performance M/T (which they had in stock) as I dug the 240Z and retro vibe. But I would have spent the difference compared with the 2025 Z Nismo. I’d need mods to increase power (HP and Torque) and put the Trans (mainly Clutch, Flywheel and pedal feel) right. But it’s not a good trans to start with.

So personally I’m cool with a Nismo 9sp AT - it shifts way, way faster and cleaner than I ever could with the 6sp MT. It doesn’t seem to hunt for gears too much- it can be a bit ‘lurchy’ when the turbos kick in, but I’m still getting used to that.

And finally - what stops me from just buying a revised ‘Nismo 6 sp MT’ if Nissan ever fixes the issues? I could try to retro fit one to my current Z if they ever design one. Someone will or already has… I dk.

So- Nissan is unlikely to do a retool for the few people that would buy a Nismo 6MT. They will buy the Performance Z and mod instead- not customers for the Nismo Z at the current price. I’m just not into modding the drivetrain at this point in my life, other things are more interesting. I feel that the 9AT tuned with shift points for the Nismo power is just a better solution. Nissan can tweak the AT programming to cure issues rather than redesign hardware. The world is changing and even die-hards need to face it.

 

[5thZ]

What is your reasoning for saying the Nissan Z manual transmission is crap, in general? Sure, to handle more power you should upgrade the clutch, flywheel but what makes it crap?

Sounds like most of your concerns are with SyncroRev/Rev matching...not the M/T itself. There are different toolings for SyncroRev and Non-Rev matching MT's anyways. Different parts on nissan parts site, so not entirely sure how that "crap" comment translates to the normal MT.

OP's original post was asking if the statement "The new Nissan Z manual transmission can't handle the power of the Nismo Z (hilarious lol)" so with that in mind I am curious what makes you call the MT crap?

 

[alienpoker]

OP's question about the #2 statement is so outrageously wrong it's hilarious. The MT in the 370Z can easily handle 700tq and hp (just get yourself an external CSC).

The MT for the Nissan Z has been improved with external CSC. You want capability to control 1000ftlb 1000hp in a manual Z? Great, upgrade the clutch. You're done.

Agree with most if your points, but I don’t think just changing the clutch and adding 1000hp/1000ftlb will fix the many issues with the Nissan Zs 6MT. Only lets it handle the power/torque. You will end up with a Monster, sure, but in a bad way.

 

[5thZ]

Agree with most if your points, but I don’t think just changing the clutch and adding 1000hp/1000ftlb will fix the many issues with the Nissan Zs 6MT. Only lets it handle the power/torque. You will end up with a Monster, sure, but in a bad way.

Just like in my last post I would like to understand what these "Many issues with the Nissan Z 6MT's" are.

If you could specify and quantify that reasoning it would help the community. I am not aware of any actual issues with the 6MT in the Nissan Z.

 

[alienpoker]

Just like in my last post I would like to understand what these "Many issues with the Nissan Z 6MT's" are.

If you could specify and quantify that reasoning it would help the community. I am not aware of any actual issues with the 6MT in the Nissan Z.

I’m way past if the 6MT can handle the power. It’s the way it puts the torque / power down that’s just wrong.

Re-read my post, I’ve tried to spell it out. It’s ZERO to do with Rev match or the mode you’re in. I hardly mention that at all. I drive the 2010 370Z Nismo almost exclusively with Rev match off - and it only kicks in on downshift anyway. So how does that affect shifts1-2 or 3-4 ?!? It doesn’t.

My main points were how badly it shifts compared to other MTs … read or search the threads here on complaints about shifts from current Z Performance MT owners. It wouldn’t let me format links, but here’s one:
https://www.nissanzclub.com/forum/threads/anyone-had-any-issues-with-shifting-6mt.2849/

I can’t understand why Nissan is still selling a trans that was in every 370Z for 15+ years and just doing a CSC delete. Except for cost effectiveness, it doesn’t make sense to me. If you like it, that’s fine. I think they’re shite.

My question to you: Why should I have to mod the Clutch / Trans / Pedal / Fluids on a brand new Transmission in my Z to get it to work as it should? I don’t need that headache and ‘trial-and-error’. Nissan should have done their homework instead of slapping in a 6sp they used for 15+ years !

Go to a VW dealership and drive a 2024 Volkswagen Golf GTI 380 S (it has a VW 6sp MT) and it’s like apples and oranges. Butter, on a cheaper car. But even VW said it’s the ‘last MT’ for that model, moving to a 7sp DSG dual-clutch AT from now on.

I’ve driven almost exclusively MT sportscars all my life going back to the 70’s - 240Z / 280Z / 300ZX … I owned a Golf GTI in the 80s which was lovely… only my wife’s BMW and my new Nismo Z are AT and that’s fine by me.

Edit: Added link to Z 6mt owner complaints re: shifting.

 

[offizial]

I’m way past if the 6MT can handle the power. It’s the way it puts the torque / power down that’s just wrong.

Re-read my post, I’ve tried to spell it out. It’s ZERO to do with Rev match or the mode you’re in. I hardly mention that at all. I drive the 2010 370Z Nismo almost exclusively with Rev match off - and it only kicks in on downshift anyway. So how does that affect shifts1-2 or 3-4 ?!? It doesn’t.

My main points were how badly it shifts compared to other MTs … read or search the threads here on complaints about shifts from current Z Performance MT owners. It wouldn’t let me format links, but here’s one:
https://www.nissanzclub.com/forum/threads/anyone-had-any-issues-with-shifting-6mt.2849/

I can’t understand why Nissan is still selling a trans that was in every 370Z for 15+ years and just doing a CSC delete. Except for cost effectiveness, it doesn’t make sense to me. If you like it, that’s fine. I think they’re shite.

My question to you: Why should I have to mod the Clutch / Trans / Pedal / Fluids on a brand new Transmission in my Z to get it to work as it should? I don’t need that headache and ‘trial-and-error’. Nissan should have done their homework instead of slapping in a 6sp they used for 15+ years !

Go to a VW dealership and drive a 2024 Volkswagen Golf GTI 380 S (it has a VW 6sp MT) and it’s like apples and oranges. Butter, on a cheaper car. But even VW said it’s the ‘last MT’ for that model, moving to a 7sp DSG dual-clutch AT from now on.

I’ve driven almost exclusively MT sportscars all my life going back to the 70’s - 240Z / 280Z / 300ZX … I owned a Golf GTI in the 80s which was lovely… only my wife’s BMW and my new Nismo Z are AT and that’s fine by me.

Edit: Added link to Z 6mt owner complaints re: shifting.

It feels Nissan, hard to explain, but their MT in all models are always like this. They are hard to shift smooth. I see where you’re coming from. The turbos do not help in this case as going through 2-3k rpm the turbos pull you and when you push in the clutch there is a lot of lurch, followed by a notch shift into 2nd is, I agree with you, not pleasing. I think it may have to do with their clutch/flywheel designs. I’m not sure. Either way I love the stick shift, and am just happy with it being a car I can have.

 

[Fanatic]

Hopefully Nissan gets the point if more people aren't buying the automatic transmission on the nismo. I personally wanted a manual and I had that in the performance version and then I picked up the automatic nismo soon after. I didn't really have too big of a problem with the automatic even though the manual is preferred. I know it's not a DCT automatic but it was still pretty decent and I wasn't totally upset about it.

I think what Nissan more importantly should do is offer a lower price point instead of waiting one or two years to put pressure on the dealers to offer bigger discounts later on to offset it.

At least we have a lot of options and you're not forced to buy a certain vehicle and there are so many other makes and models that we should be grateful for even though some may be Nissan fans to a certain extent.

I'm sure as a business, Nissan will have no choice but to look at the revenue and profits and losses because that should be one of the focal points if not the primary focal point of a business but at the same time I understand that sometimes a brand has to satisfy the enthusiast of the brand along with satisfying the masses. It's not easy but I do salute Nissan for doing it mostly all by themselves if not all by themself because brands like Toyota (which I do respect and appreciate) - keeps merging with Subaru and BMW to make their sports cars aside from the gr Corolla.

 

[Dot’s son]

Maybe being 49 makes me "old", but I don't consider a car a "sports car" or a "Performance car" if it does not have a manual transmission. IDGAF if it is a Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari, GT-500, etc.

I've said it repeatedly, and I'll give the devil his due; the AT will beat me in my 6MT Sport (WITH a factory LSD) every day of the week, and twice on Sunday. I get that. But with an AT you lose that connection, that synergy with the car. You lose the feedback. You don't know where your car makes it's power by the FEEL you get from the "pedal push vs RPM vs what gear you are in". I don't really "shift" the Z. I end up slowing down, and my mind, left foot, and right hand instinctively put it in the correct gear.

My $0.02.

Maybe it is an old man thing? I’m 52 and totally agree with Mugzilla

 

[Dot’s son]

Not sure if you've ever actually driven a NISMO before because this part of your statement is objectively incorrect as it has a Manual Mode that allows the driver to control the gearing using paddle shifters.

To me, changing gears is not the same without a clutch

 

[Mr. Mac]

To me, changing gears is not the same without a clutch

Of course, and I happen agree with you, but again, as clearly stated in the OP, this topic has absolutely nothing to do with subjective opinions, rather trying to understand the objective and confusing reasoning repeatedly stated by Nissan’s employees, dealers, techs, industry insiders, etc. There’s countless other posts/threads for discussing the subjective opinions of manual v automatic transmissions. Was really hoping this topic wasn’t going to devolve into one of those types of threads. No luck on that, unfortunately.

BTW, my response that you quoted was me stating an objective fact, not an opinion.

 

[Fanatic]

Some of you guys should ride a sport bike or do karting or road bicycling and get addicted to these if you're after the feel and connection. Cars are becoming more diluted (and costly) than ever.