Still willing to pay markup after all the reviews?

[raptor5244]

ADMs don't help out the manufacturer at all.

A $10k price jump for a car that's like 70-80% recycled is madness. I would GLADLY pay MSRP if the Performance Z came in at $45k, but it doesn't so I'm not.

Exactly, ADMs actually hurt manufacturers. They upset customers and damage the brand. GM and Ford are finally cracking down but this shit needs to stop. Folks will be so upside down on these cars in a few years if they pay 10-20k markups. You better love the Z so much, you will be buried in it.

 

[ZDreamer]

You're forgetting about the ADM that will certainly be there on 2023 Supra (regardless of MT or AT). So, whichever price you're comparing to, if the Z Proto is marked up $10k, imagine same if not slightly more for Supra 6MT A91 (limited spec) $58k+$10k, so $68k.

The price comparison, apples to apples, only works if both cars get sold at MSRP.

If there’s no ADM right now on Supra, and everybody are happy with their AT, then the risk of ADM is low for their base 2023 model I6 (MT or AT). The A91 6MT model is different , like you said w/ limited number, and I’m not comparing that one.

For Nissan z, it will be a long honeymoon phase and everybody will be antsy to get one bc is new but for the MT Supra, it’ll be like a second marriage w/ near zero honeymoon.

More importantly Toyota don’t have chip shortage problem like Nissan.

 

[Blackbeard]

also dealers get sold the cars at a dealer invoice price , msrp is a point where toyota or nissan etc etc feels the dealer can sell the car at a good price and still make profit

 

[TaroBaapG35]

If there’s no ADM right now on Supra, and everybody are happy with their AT, then the risk of ADM is low for their base 2023 model I6 (MT or AT). The A91 6MT model is different , like you said w/ limited number, and I’m not comparing that one.

For Nissan z, it will be a long honeymoon phase and everybody will be antsy to get one bc is new but for the MT Supra, it’ll be like a second marriage w/ near zero honeymoon.

More importantly Toyota don’t have chip shortage problem like Nissan.

That's true since the market is already diluted with 2-3yr old supras; aside from the addition of 6mt, I don't recall reading of any big changes (mid cycle refresh) that they're pushing through. Possibly 2024 model.

 

[Blackbeard]

That's true since the market is already diluted with 2-3yr old supras; aside from the addition of 6mt, I don't recall reading of any big changes (mid cycle refresh) that they're pushing through. Possibly 2024 model.

the 23 is suppose to have even more tuned suspension and pin point turning or some shit like that

 

[TaroBaapG35]

the 23 is suppose to have even more tuned suspension and pin point turning or some shit like that

So not a deal breaker to most; Unless you leased a '20, minor reasons to upgrade to '23 minus the 6MT...Let's see what those markups start at, as almost every car has a markup right now.

 

[Sereph]

That's true since the market is already diluted with 2-3yr old supras; aside from the addition of 6mt, I don't recall reading of any big changes (mid cycle refresh) that they're pushing through. Possibly 2024 model.

The 2023 Manual and auto cars will have suspension refinements and other electronic changes that have to do with the Sport Mode characteristics if I remember correctly. They are basically, just like from the 2020 model to the 2021 model, making more changes to make the car handle better both in the corners and in the straights.

 

[Blackbeard]

So not a deal breaker to most; Unless you leased a '20, minor reasons to upgrade to '23 minus the 6MT...Let's see what those markups start at, as almost every car has a markup right now.

oh yea hell no ive always driven stick, i knew it was going to come but i didnt want to wait but i wouldnt trade in my car just to go up one

 

[ceric]

Recession is on the horizon. Chip shortage is going away. ADM will not stay for long after initial craze. It will go back to MSRP or below by end of the year. I will wait.

 

[takemorepills]

Supra
- Underrated and quite bit more powerful. Like low 12s vs. 13.0 sec 1/4mi

The difference between an AT Supra and an AT Z isn't that big.

Are you comparing 6MT Z to the 8AT Supra?

Because, like almost every modern 6MT option, it's significantly slower than the AT option.....

 

[raptor5244]

The difference between an AT Supra and an AT Z isn't that big.

Are you comparing 6MT Z to the 8AT Supra?

Because, like almost every modern 6MT option, it's significantly slower than the AT option.....

You are correct, those were the Z MT times vs. Supra AT times. It is closer auto to auto but both the Supra and Mustang are faster in a straight line and much faster around a track. It look like if Nissan would put some better tires (at least on the performance trim) it would fair better off the line.

 

[Drseckzytime]

Nobody should pay ADM out of principle in the first place.

That said the Z premium isn't worth it's asking price. It's missing out on so much performance, bells, and whistles compared to the competition, as well as fit and finish. There are much better options for the money. But as car lovers, we don't always do the most rational things, though I have gotten better.

I was smitten by the looks of the Z, gorgeous car. But I got over it thankfully and got a superior car and overall package of a car for the same price (2SS 1LE w/sunroof). It too is a good looking car with a great heritage, but I wanted a sports car that can also track and GT, and this can. And it sounds wonderful.

The better value of Z is getting the base and having $10k laying around for a proper suspension, tires, brakes, exhaust, and a diff. The premium isn't worth it, many superior options to it. Supra, SS 1LE, Mustang GTP, M240i..

 

[siggy]

Exactly, ADMs actually hurt manufacturers. They upset customers and damage the brand. GM and Ford are finally cracking down but this shit needs to stop. Folks will be so upside down on these cars in a few years if they pay 10-20k markups. You better love the Z so much, you will be buried in it.

Ford and GM are not cracking down. They sent out a letter that was pretty much ignored.

 

[But Does It Djent?]

Nope. If I can't get a sport trim Z for under $45k including fees and tax, I'll wait. That's all I feel the car is worth. I'm unsure if that's realistic right now though, as I'm worried dealers will be charging performance trim prices for the sport. ADMs need to be illegal

 

[takemorepills]

Ford and GM are not cracking down. They sent out a letter that was pretty much ignored.

Lot's of dealers are selling new cars as "used" as the manufacturers have even less say over used pricing. So, if the manufacturers wag their finger at a dealership, they just list the cars as "used"