This Seems Like A Pretty Fair Assessment Of The Z From Car and Driver

[Denver the Last Dinosaur]

Inflation is rampant and will not subside.

Yep. A few years ago a packet of cookies cost $1, now they cost $3.50. Everything is going up, and every time one something like fuel prices or wages go up, everything that relies on that has to go up in price too. It's a never-ending ripple effect or rolling ball gathering more and more moss.

 

[takemorepills]

I agree with you, the price of the car initially deterred me as well, but unfortunately in the current macro environment where Civics are going for ~$35k-$40k the price increase for the Z, as much as I hate it, is sort of understandable. The Supra, luckily priced it high (at the time), sold well, and this will sell the same.

Look at GTRs now, a $60k GTR is now $80k. Inflation is rampant and will not subside.

It's pretty rare for a COVID-era new model to maintain previous pricing.
If a manufacturer does manage to avoid a big price increase, it's usually due to shrinkflation.
Good example is the new Civic Si...not much more expensive, but heavily decontented from the previous generation and performs worse, too.

New trucks are definitely taking advantage of pandemic tax, any new truck released in COVID era, such as Tundra and updated GM trucks, are seeing a huge MSRP increase, and we get to face ADMs on top of that!

The Z pricing seems fine, all things considered.

I highly doubt Nissan is looking to "screw" consumers on the Z.

 

[RicerX]

If anything, Nissan absolutely cannot afford ANYTHING that would stain their brand image at this point. This is a marque that is in repair. The Z, Frontier, and Ariya are ushering in the "New Nissan". These cars HAVE to nail it for them. I would say the Frontier was extremely well done for what they had to work with (and they still hit a segment best in horsepower with it despite limited resources - they built a brand new engine for it). The jury is out on the Ariya, and to a lesser extent the Z.

 

[RicerX]

I agree with you, the price of the car initially deterred me as well, but unfortunately in the current macro environment where Civics are going for ~$35k-$40k the price increase for the Z, as much as I hate it, is sort of understandable. The Supra, luckily priced it high (at the time), sold well, and this will sell the same.

Look at GTRs now, a $60k GTR is now $80k. Inflation is rampant and will not subside.

It's crazy man. I have found used Civic Type-Rs with 30k on the clock for FIFTY THOUSAND DOLLARS. W. T. F.

 

[takemorepills]

If anything, Nissan absolutely cannot afford ANYTHING that would stain their brand image at this point. This is a marque that is in repair. The Z, Frontier, and Ariya are ushering in the "New Nissan". These cars HAVE to nail it for them. I would say the Frontier was extremely well done for what they had to work with (and they still hit a segment best in horsepower with it despite limited resources - they built a brand new engine for it). The jury is out on the Ariya, and to a lesser extent the Z.

Frontier is a huge fail to me.
Very limited options, ancient architecture (which I'd otherwise be ok with)
I want a 4 door long bed truck with all the options, and you can't get that with the frontier. The only version offered in a fully loaded trim is the Pro4x which is hobbled by a uselessly small bed.

I'm shopping Toyota because of that.

 

[LZ23]

It's crazy man. I have found used Civic Type-Rs with 30k on the clock for FIFTY THOUSAND DOLLARS. W. T. F.

I think the price of the Z represents good value ,the new gr corolla circuit is going to be around 55k to 60k in Canada.That to me does not represent good value.

 

[Raven1]

Frontier is a huge fail to me.
Very limited options, ancient architecture (which I'd otherwise be ok with)
I want a 4 door long bed truck with all the options, and you can't get that with the frontier. The only version offered in a fully loaded trim is the Pro4x which is hobbled by a uselessly small bed.

I'm shopping Toyota because of that.

In that segment the Tacoma is the only one that offers a long bed in both 4X4 and Pre-Runner configurations. If you can live with it, get the previous body style, the latest iteration throttle response and transmission gearing is horrendous!! Of all of the Tacoma models ever made this latest model has been traded in / returned in less than 2 years. If you live in a flat area like So Cal or AZ then throttle response can be remedied with a 'Sprint Booster.' But if you live in a region where the truck is constantly traveling slight hills and inclines essentially under load then you'll hate the shift points and how underpowered the truck feels. #1 Reason the truck has been traded in was for being sluggish and underpowered, specifically while towing.

Moving from AZ to Lake Oswego my 07 Tacoma gas mileage went to shit. But never had any issues with power or feeling under powered. However, driving friend's and families new model Tacos in AZ they felt just like my 07, although my 4.0L had gobs more torque. But up north, they drove like total dogs and I kept asking myself while the hell am I in such a high gear making going up hills sluggish and trying to pass anyone sketchy when the truck downshifts a couple gears and the engine starts howling.

Just something to consider when look at newer model tacos . . .

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[takemorepills]

In that segment the Tacoma is the only one that offers a long bed in both 4X4 and Pre-Runner configurations. If you can live with it, get the previous body style, the latest iteration throttle response and transmission gearing is horrendous!! Of all of the Tacoma models ever made this latest model has been traded in / returned in less than 2 years. If you live in a flat area like So Cal or AZ then throttle response can be remedied with a 'Sprint Booster.' But if you live in a region where the truck is constantly traveling slight hills and inclines essentially under load then you'll hate the shift points and how underpowered the truck feels. #1 Reason the truck has been traded in was for being sluggish and underpowered, specifically while towing.

Moving from AZ to Lake Oswego my 07 Tacoma gas mileage went to shit. But never had any issues with power or feeling under powered. However, driving friend's and families new model Tacos in AZ they felt just like my 07, although my 4.0L had gobs more torque. But up north, they drove like total dogs and I kept asking myself while the hell am I in such a high gear making going up hills sluggish and trying to pass anyone sketchy when the truck downshifts a couple gears and the engine starts howling.

Just something to consider when look at newer model tacos . . .

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My buddy has a current gen Tacoma. He said basically the same thing, the transmission is all over the place and the 3.5 feels like a car engine in a truck.

I have heard that the 6MT drives much better. However, the 6MT is only available in imited configurations. Pretty sure I can't get a Tacoma long bed 4 door with locker, LED lighting and 6MT.

I'd love to consider previous gen Tacoma (heck, I kinda considered the 4Runner because it kept the great old drivetrain) but the resale value and pandemic tax make it unjustifiably expensive.

I've been looking at the new Tundra, I can get the exact config I want, you can get a fairly middlin SR5 with locker and other goodies, including 4 doors and long bed. I am well aware of the issues they are having, and the pandemic tax/ADMs on them are still a minimum of $5K, so that's making it real easy to keep on trucking in my 2007 Titan.

I don't think these crazy times are going to improve for at least another 3+ years. Really don't think many of us are going to be able to get a Z either..........

 

[Raven1]

My buddy has a current gen Tacoma. He said basically the same thing, the transmission is all over the place and the 3.5 feels like a car engine in a truck.

I have heard that the 6MT drives much better. However, the 6MT is only available in imited configurations. Pretty sure I can't get a Tacoma long bed 4 door with locker, LED lighting and 6MT.

I'd love to consider previous gen Tacoma (heck, I kinda considered the 4Runner because it kept the great old drivetrain) but the resale value and pandemic tax make it unjustifiably expensive.

I've been looking at the new Tundra, I can get the exact config I want, you can get a fairly middlin SR5 with locker and other goodies, including 4 doors and long bed. I am well aware of the issues they are having, and the pandemic tax/ADMs on them are still a minimum of $5K, so that's making it real easy to keep on trucking in my 2007 Titan.

I don't think these crazy times are going to improve for at least another 3+ years. Really don't think many of us are going to be able to get a Z either..........

I agree that we won't be getting into a Z anytime soon, at least not at a reasonable price. We're patient so this is a non issue.

Have you considered heading down south? When I picked up the Gladiator none of the Oregon dealerships wanted to work with me. So we finally wound up buying in Phoenix, saved 13k and got more truck & 8 year extended warranty than what we test drove in Oregon. Trucks are fairly more common there and better priced than other parts of the country. I believe it might benefit to research that option for an hour or 2 and see if it might be viable.

What ever Toyota truck you choose it'll be solid and reliable, really the only reason I've parted with any of mine is because I wanted something newer. The only issues ever experienced have been starters, alternators, belts and batteries.

And I don't see things improving in the near future either! Forgive me for saying but I believe you're going to run into a sweet deal simply due to the seller being in a bad spot that you'll capitalize on. I'm only saying what we're all thinking (and hoping to God doesn't happen to us) when I state that the sweet deals some of us in a position to do so will be scooping up will be because, Economically, the fit is going to hit the shan in short order . . .

 

[takemorepills]

I agree that we won't be getting into a Z anytime soon, at least not at a reasonable price. We're patient so this is a non issue.

Have you considered heading down south? When I picked up the Gladiator none of the Oregon dealerships wanted to work with me. So we finally wound up buying in Phoenix, saved 13k and got more truck & 8 year extended warranty than what we test drove in Oregon. Trucks are fairly more common there and better priced than other parts of the country. I believe it might benefit to research that option for an hour or 2 and see if it might be viable.

What ever Toyota truck you choose it'll be solid and reliable, really the only reason I've parted with any of mine is because I wanted something newer. The only issues ever experienced have been starters, alternators, belts and batteries.

And I don't see things improving in the near future either! Forgive me for saying but I believe you're going to run into a sweet deal simply due to the seller being in a bad spot that you'll capitalize on. I'm only saying what we're all thinking (and hoping to God doesn't happen to us) when I state that the sweet deals some of us in a position to do so will be scooping up will be because, Economically, the fit is going to hit the shan in short order . . .

As far as looking around goes, I don't mind a long drive to get a good deal. However, other forums are reporting that dealers everywhere want a minimum $5K ADM, and the very few who will sell at MSRP adamantly won't sell to out-of-state people. I did work a deal on a Tundra for $995 over MSRP locally, but there's no cappers being made for these yet (a must for us, Leer has said they are having issues with the fiberglass mold process) and my wife pointed out that our current Titan is still perfectly meeting our needs. I just want a new toy!

We've had our Titan for 14 years now, and it's been extremely reliable. At least as good as a Toyota.

We just recently completed a road trip to AZ and did some semi-serious off-roading there, and I am not so sure a new Tundra would have survived that! Still love the new Tundras, just may need to be more "careful" as they have a lot of flimsy plastic hanging low and no tow hooks.

 

[Raven1]

As far as looking around goes, I don't mind a long drive to get a good deal. However, other forums are reporting that dealers everywhere want a minimum $5K ADM, and the very few who will sell at MSRP adamantly won't sell to out-of-state people. I did work a deal on a Tundra for $995 over MSRP locally, but there's no cappers being made for these yet (a must for us, Leer has said they are having issues with the fiberglass mold process) and my wife pointed out that our current Titan is still perfectly meeting our needs. I just want a new toy!

We've had our Titan for 14 years now, and it's been extremely reliable. At least as good as a Toyota.

We just recently completed a road trip to AZ and did some semi-serious off-roading there, and I am not so sure a new Tundra would have survived that! Still love the new Tundras, just may need to be more "careful" as they have a lot of flimsy plastic hanging low and no tow hooks.

The Titan is solid and like many Nissan vehicles Nissan left a lot of power on the table. That Titan is a beast once modded and tuned!!

My brother has the Tundy and surprisingly not as capable as it's smaller little brother the Taco, you see a bunch more people mobbin the Tacos in the desert than you do the Tundra, I'm not saying you can't, just saying you don't anywhere near as many when compared to the Taco!

Good luck on which ever truck you eventually slide into . . .

 

[takemorepills]

The Titan is solid and like many Nissan vehicles Nissan left a lot of power on the table. That Titan is a beast once modded and tuned!!

My brother has the Tundy and surprisingly not as capable as it's smaller little brother the Taco, you see a bunch more people mobbin the Tacos in the desert than you do the Tundra, I'm not saying you can't, just saying you don't anywhere near as many when compared to the Taco!

Good luck on which ever truck you eventually slide into . . .

The Tacomas are definitely very capable off-road. However, very curious to see what Toyota does with the next Gen Tacoma. They've done a lot to the Tundra and Sequoia that made them into more "mainstream" and less rugged. Wondering if Toyota does the same to the Tacoma and 4Runner!

 

[Denver the Last Dinosaur]

it's clear that it isn't some high performance track star vehicle.

I don't think anybody ever thought it would be, especially those that know the Nissan Z cars - previous versions certainly weren't either (factory standard anyway, without lots of modification).

 

[NiZmonium]

I don't think anybody ever thought it would be, especially those that know the Nissan Z cars - previous versions certainly weren't either (factory standard anyway, without lots of modification).

So even though Nissan calls it a performance Sports Car , it's not really a sports car .

Got it

 

[takemorepills]

So even though Nissan calls it a performance Sports Car , it's not really a sports car .

Got it

Please provide the definition of a sports car so I can relate to your conclusion