First wave of Zs have landed in the U.S.

[etater]

so bad news and bad news...

after talking to the new car manager today, he said there will be $2495 dealer mark-up plus the add-on. he also said he's not sure, but there may also be a market adjustment on top of that!

he said it would be a month or two before the Z shows up. normally when nissan launched a new model, they bring a car by the dealership to teach the salesman and mechanics the ins and outs of the car.

then the cars usually goes on sale about a month after that. he said so far no one has shown up from nissan yet and feels it might be about a month before that happens.

Very curious to see how consumers react to these markups. I genuinely believe it could tank their sales despite all the people waiting to buy for 2 reasons:

1. The Z's pricing is in a precarious spot - 6 grand more than the performance can get you a Supra Premium or used BMW M-series that will entirely out-perform the Z (with better build quality and a chassis that isn't 13 years old).

2. Almost every economist is predicting a recession this Fall. If that happens, car sales will drop and dealerships could begin to sell below MSRP, so waiting to buy could result in a significant discount and lower interest rates if you finance.

 

[rocksandblues]

I think there is so few of them and so many people that want one (almost no matter what) they will all sell. After the initial flurry of pent up demand is over- 2024 and or if they actually produce any real amount of them things will balance out.

 

[indio22]

I think there is so few of them and so many people that want one (almost no matter what) they will all sell. After the initial flurry of pent up demand is over- 2024 and or if they actually produce any real amount of them things will balance out.

Yep I think initially people will pay extra, because that's what people do. I'm eager to find out Nissan production targets and capacity, because that will partly tell the tale, of future prices.

I've had a suspicion that Nissan plans to produce fewer Zs than we would like, not counting COVID related restrictions on top of that. That's a reason I predicted way back, that a guy like me without connections and who won't pay ADM, would not see a Z in my driveway until earliest 2024.

I think it will be a bad scene overall (at least in USA) in terms of cost/availability unfortunately.

 

[jdm-rhd]

So they are hitting u with 2 markups

actually there are 3 for this dealership...

1. from what im gathering, the $2495 is some type of care package for the customer...car washs, tire rotation, ect.

2. add-ons...paint, floors mats, lighting, etc...whatever factory options added by nissan.

3. market adjustment - amount they are going to charge above msrp and the first 2 mark-ups.

 

[jdm-rhd]

Very curious to see how consumers react to these markups. I genuinely believe it could tank their sales despite all the people waiting to buy for 2 reasons:

1. The Z's pricing is in a precarious spot - 6 grand more than the performance can get you a Supra Premium or used BMW M-series that will entirely out-perform the Z (with better build quality and a chassis that isn't 13 years old).

2. Almost every economist is predicting a recession this Fall. If that happens, car sales will drop and dealerships could begin to sell below MSRP, so waiting to buy could result in a significant discount and lower interest rates if you finance.

im number 10 on my dealerships list. i think they will go down the list and see how much each customer is willing to pay. those mark-ups are just the starting point im afraid...

 

[jdm-rhd]

I think there is so few of them and so many people that want one (almost no matter what) they will all sell. After the initial flurry of pent up demand is over- 2024 and or if they actually produce any real amount of them things will balance out.

after seeing what my dealer said they wanted, knowing how few will be shipped initially, i can see how the dealership in guam was asking $58-62k for their Z's...

 

[jdm-rhd]

Yep I think initially people will pay extra, because that's what people do. I'm eager to find out Nissan production targets and capacity, because that will partly tell the tale, of future prices.

I've had a suspicion that Nissan plans to produce fewer Zs than we would like, not counting COVID related restrictions on top of that. That's a reason I predicted way back, that a guy like me without connections and who won't pay ADM, would not see a Z in my driveway until earliest 2024.

I think it will be a bad scene overall (at least in USA) in terms of cost/availability unfortunately.

think of what ppl are paying for c8's...two years later. if nissan keeps production numbers low, they can in theory get more...at least above msrp for a while.

im afraid people will be willing to pay. look at the demand for regular cars and suvs...

 

[Donalex]

If nissan keeps production numbers low, they can in theory get more...at least above msrp for a while.

The manufacturer is not getting any more money than the wholesale price the dealers are paying. Only the dealers win after MSRP.

The MORE cars are sold, the more the manufacturer gets.

In normal times, New Car Sales are the fifth and last highest profit center for a dealership. They are, it order of most profitable:

1) Service
2) Parts
3) Used cars
4) F&I - finance and insurance
5) New cars as they are mostly commodities

 

[fliplover]

I don't think Nissan Japan will artificially keep production down. If I understand correctly, the ADM's go directly in the dealer's pockets. Nothing gets kicked back to the head office. From the factory's standpoint, more cars equals more profit.

 

[StrikeS30]

I don't think Nissan Japan will artificially keep production down. If I understand correctly, the ADM's go directly in the dealer's pockets. Nothing gets kicked back to the head office. From the factory's standpoint, more cars equals more profit.

Agreed with the above. Nissan HQ's goal is to pump out and sell as many of these as possible.
The more they can manufacture, the more they make, and can put back into their own R&D.

The only ones profiting from raising prices on the lots are the dealership chains and families. The dealers will pay the same invoice for their inventory.

 

[jaymes]

I think if people chill out then the prices will go down

 

[indio22]

I don't think Nissan Japan will artificially keep production down. If I understand correctly, the ADM's go directly in the dealer's pockets. Nothing gets kicked back to the head office. From the factory's standpoint, more cars equals more profit.

It's not necessarily about keeping production artificially low, rather it's about planned output. Way back during planning, Nissan decided on the resources to allocate and the max profit per unit targets in terms of production. And a number of factors went into that.

My hunch is planned production will be lower than we might like. And Nissan can't simply "make more", they are constrained by resources and increased cost per unit as they hit certain higher production numbers.

I'd love to be a fly on the wall, and know the target Z production numbers, along with possible max capacity. Time will tell how well demand matches with what Nissan is willing/capable of producing.

 

[jdm-rhd]

don't you guys remember that article where the government was trying stop car manufacturers from using chip shortages to keep prices high?

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a37727004/feds-dpa-chip-shortage-auto-manufacturing/

 

[takemorepills]

actually there are 3 for this dealership...

1. from what im gathering, the $2495 is some type of care package for the customer...car washs, tire rotation, ect.

2. add-ons...paint, floors mats, lighting, etc...whatever factory options added by nissan.

3. market adjustment - amount they are going to charge above msrp and the first 2 mark-ups.

#2 doesn't count. Factory installed items, whilst rare on Nissan, have a fixed price on the window sticker, don't go to the dealer, and are far more valuable than "starcote windshield and armrest protecting coating" that you can't even tell if the dealership even bothered to spray those "miracle applications" on the vehicle. They're selling you stuff you can't see or be sure exists.
Same for ADM. Paying for nothingness.

 

[Georges1]

There are folks who go to the dealer & let the car memorize them to the point they will pay almost anything. Of course, the dealers know that & will take advantage. Some dealers will be good to work with while others will skin the buyer. It will be interesting to see how sales are handled once the cars are available.