A Great Conversation with Dan Passe on 2023 Nissan Z [Specs, Release, Pricing]

[McLovin157]

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Figuring in inflation compared to 90 MSRP, it is a decent deal for weirdo world we live in.
If it wasn't for the fact that it's becoming irreplaceable and one car accident could take it away, I'd rather have the Z32 than the new Z.

I just don’t like working on VG motors ?

 

[siggy]

Gonna stop ya right there. I know we're all frustrated at the continued lack of details, myself included, but Dan doesn't HAVE to continue to sign on here and reply to us whenever he has time, or has news to share. Nor does @McLovin157 HAVE to continue to sign on here, in his situation to provide insights into the dealer side of things and what he's able to pry out of the corporate overlords. I think it's a fair assumption, and beyond that, certain both have said as much, they're both doing it because they care—about the community and, of course, the car. I agree that the process has been less than ideal, I know I've said it as well, but I don't think either of them should be the target of our ire.

As someone who also works in an industry where discretion is SOP, I get why Dan is not sharing everything now. Yes, subjectively speaking it sucks, but objectively speaking its his livelihood at risk. It's also very possible there are a lot of things that have yet to be worked out! So, in turn, there's nothing to share. We don't know.

What has either provided, though? Actually genuinely curious. I haven't read every post on this forum, but I haven't come across anything either have said of real value. Not meant to be a personal attack. Just an observation on my part.

 

[McLovin157]

What has either provided, though? Actually genuinely curious. I haven't read every post on this forum, but I haven't come across anything either have said of real value. Not meant to be a personal attack. Just an observation on my part.

The point of the thread was to shed light on rumors that were going around as well as a place to further post information I’ve found. I understand it’s frustrating for everyone not getting the answers we want but the information either isn’t available or not known. Check the thread every so often and see what’s posted about the Z and it’s status

 

[Blackbeard]

Lol I feel like this is what we have become lol give us Frankenstein lol

 

[McLovin157]

Lol I feel like this is what we have become lol give us Frankenstein lol

FACTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Andaesthetics]

I get your point, but the whole purpose of a redesign is to reinvigorate sales - not so that they could continue to have less-than-stellar or paltry numbers.

With that said, I agree. It's not surprising, unfortunately - especially given the way this whole thing has been playing out thus far.

That is exactly the point, but looking at things from a financial standpoint there is no real way to gauge how a car will sell until looking at the first quarter and second quarter of sales. Of course we want sales to go up, but it's no secret that sports cars are in the minority of sales in the car market. Nissan is never going to produce the new Z at a high volume because the demand is simply never going to be high enough. Yes there is demand right now, but the current demand is from car enthusiasts, which again equates to a minority percent of car buyers. The average person does not give 2 shits about the Z. Hell most people probably still don't even know about the new Z.

Why do you think Nissan created the Ariya from the ground up and not the new Z? Because electric cars and SUVs are the most popular cars on the market.

The point of the thread was to shed light on rumors that were going around as well as a place to further post information I’ve found. I understand it’s frustrating for everyone not getting the answers we want but the information either isn’t available or not known. Check the thread every so often and see what’s posted about the Z and it’s status

Yet no real light or 100% solid info has been shed. Honestly it's just playing ping pong with rumors at this point and adding little random details that are already known or speculating further on other speculations.

 

[Donalex]

That is exactly the point, but looking at things from a financial standpoint there is no real way to gauge how a car will sell until looking at the first quarter and second quarter of sales. .

Listen, it's not their first rodeo. I'm sure they know EXACTLY what they're doing. It's not rocket science. That's why it takes years to launch a new or restyled model before the first panel is welded.

Typically, it takes about a billion dollars to get a car into the market, and that was a few years ago.

And, each successive edition of a nameplate employs legacy parts and platforms for a decade or more.

 

[Mardoc01]

Listen, it's not their first rodeo. I'm sure they know EXACTLY what they're doing. It's not rocket science. That's why it takes years to launch a new or restyled model before the first panel is welded.

Typically, it takes about a billion dollars to get a car into the market, and that was a few years ago.

And, each successive edition of a nameplate employs legacy parts and platforms for a decade or more.

Do you feel a roughly 9k base increase is correct for a car that is about 50 percent new from Prev model?

 

[Donalex]

Do you feel a roughly 9k base increase is correct for a car that is about 50 percent new from Prev model?

Nope, and that's why I'm not a player for a new one. I could see a three or four grand increase as justifiable.

I've only purchased one new car in my life and that was the MR2 Spyder, a car that Toyota imported only 2,000 a year. I drove three different ones for fourteen years.

I'm looking at two or three years down the road as depreciation does it's magic. My current Z32 is in mechanically and aesthetically excellent condition .

 

[McLovin157]

Do you feel a roughly 9k base increase is correct for a car that is about 50 percent new from Prev model?

Yea I think that 40k hits the nail on the head pretty spot on.

 

[siggy]

Yea I think that 40k hits the nail on the head pretty spot on.

Wasn’t the 2020 370z base MSRP $31k? So now you’re going back to 2009? And then using a Feb ‘22 inflation report when Nissan announced ball park pricing last year. And so a 29% increase hits the nail on the head? And while manufacturers have been increasing prices, it hasn’t been to the tune of 29%. Can you tell me what my monthly payment will be for a Z? Give it to me true care salesman style! ?

 

[LeatherWings]

Yea I think that 40k hits the nail on the head pretty spot on.

In 2009, the 370Z was an almost entirely new design with about a $2k* increase in base MSRP over the 350Z. On the other hand, and as we all know, the 2023 Z is reusing a lot of existing componentry.

Now is the new Z base model worth the ~$40k price tag? If they had included LSD and rev matching (and maybe better brakes), I'd say absolutely, yes. As is? I dunno, I'm trying to decide.

I know that many will argue that $40k won't get you anything else with 400hp, but my decision-making is not based solely on HP and 0-60 numbers. My 2002 Honda 919 motorcycle cost me less than $4,000 used and can do 0-60 in 3.2 seconds. Apples to oranges, I know... my point is just that there needs to be more than horsepower to sway me.


I will say though..... just looking at the new Z might be enough to sway me ?

*$2k in 2009 is ~$2,644.91 in 2022 dollars

 

[Mardoc01]

Yea I think that 40k hits the nail on the head pretty spot on.

Nice try buddy. 2020 prices were 31k. I now know why car salesman get a bad wrap. Lol. jk

 

[McLovin157]

Nice try buddy. 2020 prices were 31k. I now know why car salesman get a bad wrap. Lol. jk

The 370z changed almost nothing from 2009 to 2020. Thus the price never really rose much more than it’s original MSRP. I mean the tech in the new Z alone could justify a starting price of 35k. The 370Z had nothing but outdated tech till it’s death. Put a turbo and standard rev match with better improved components and it really does make sense. 30k now buys you a civic or a Miata; a Toyota 86 as well.

 

[Mardoc01]

The 370z changed almost nothing from 2009 to 2020. Thus the price never really rose much more than it’s original MSRP. I mean the tech in the new Z alone could justify a starting price of 35k. The 370Z had nothing but outdated tech till it’s death. Put a turbo and standard rev match with better improved components and it really does make sense. 30k now buys you a civic or a Miata; a Toyota 86 as well.

So we agree. 35 k should be the new price….