General Ask a Nissan Salesman Thread

[McLovin157]

An interesting point I would also like to throw out to everyone here. There has been bragging about paying under MSRP so the two question I propose is.

If dealers are evil for charging over MSRP why is it victorious for individuals to get less than MSRP?
Why is it ok for an individual to buy at MSRP and sell at a crazy mark up but not a dealership?

If a total online model is adopted then there will never be a deal done under MSRP it will be like buying anything. No special deals for buying x number of cars at a location or being a loyal service customer. You will just pay what the manufacturer decides the price should be. There will be no going over features, or hands on coaching on what a vehicle does they will just be online videos. I by no means am saying the dealer model is perfect or efficient. Though I do enjoy a more personal experience and that is impossible to attain by doing everything online or on a "dealer" tablet.

A heavy topic that will get super heated but one I'm curious what others think.

 

[McLovin157]

Not sure how consumer is pocketing the profit if they buy the car to drive. You are probably talking about car flipping but that only applies to specialty cars like the Porsche GT3 and such, which the Z is not.

I understand this is a supply and demand thing but the demand is artificial because there is always someone who wants to be the 1st one to get the new shiny stuff. And those are the ones that are willing to pay for the ADM. Good for them, but I just think is stupid. I know some of you disagree but is ok.

The supply thing is 100% not artificial. This kind of profit pocketing used to only apply to specialty vehicle but currently it's just about everything. Pathfinders are on a 3-4 month wait, Rogues are 2 months, Sentras are spotty availability or 1 month along with Altimas. Had a guy who traded an F150 with 25k miles he bought new in 2020 and he got 6k more than what he paid for it.

 

[Donalex]

I came across an article on Jalopnik a few days ago that said Ford was going around their reservation retail customers to send new Broncos to heavy hitter dealers.

So much for manufacturers crackin' heads...

 

[takemorepills]

This again…there is nothing to debate. We’re all just playing by the rules. There are laws or a lack there of, good or bad. Supply and demand. Basic economics. Right now lots of demand but no supply. Can you please provide me with an AUS forum so I can post ad nauseam when I get my next car 10-20% under MSRP while you’re paying MSRP?

No offense West Aussie, but this guy is dead-on.

I tried to explain this in another thread, we have a flip side to greedy adm, and it's called getting a vehicle at or below invoice in the USA. 90% of the time, in normal times, below MSRP is always the norm.

I see 2 things going on, 1 is people hate paying ADM. I 110 % agree.
2 is I get the feeling that people think "if we banned ADM......" then inventory would magically appear.
If we don't have ADM, you still don't get a car, except for luck.

What really sucks is that we've all been at each other's necks for the last 2 years for something out of our control. The situation we are in was created by a certain place on our green globe, and those of us in the Western world have been pissed at each other for all kinds of reasons this entire time.
We blame people for not doing this or that, we get mad at dealers in USA for being greedy, we censor facts when inconvenient, all while totally ignoring how we got here. Manufacturers just can't make enough cars. And sometimes the cars they make get burned up on a cargo ship in the middle of the ocean.

Nissan set a fair MSRP on the new Z. If they could make enough, we'd be negotiating from MSRP. They can't.

So, next time you get mad at someone for not wearing a facemask, or a dealer marking up a vehicle in tight supply, get mad at China for fucking putting us in dystopia world, stop getting mad at people who didn't create the damn problem.

 

[McLovin157]

I came across an article on Jalopnik a few days ago that said Ford was going around their reservation retail customers to send new Broncos to heavy hitter dealers.

So much for manufacturers crackin' heads...

The dealer is the one crackin heads not manufactureres. Though again I truly believe this is just for PR. a few select dealers get cut and the rest get to continue to sell.

 

[McLovin157]

No offense West Aussie, but this guy is dead-on.

I tried to explain this in another thread, we have a flip side to greedy adm, and it's called getting a vehicle at or below invoice in the USA. 90% of the time, in normal times, below MSRP is always the norm.

I see 2 things going on, 1 is people hate paying ADM. I 110 % agree.
2 is I get the feeling that people think "if we banned ADM......" then inventory would magically appear.
If we don't have ADM, you still don't get a car, except for luck.

What really sucks is that we've all been at each other's necks for the last 2 years for something out of our control. The situation we are in was created by a certain place on our green globe, and those of us in the Western world have been pissed at each other for all kinds of reasons this entire time.
We blame people for not doing this or that, we get mad at dealers in USA for being greedy, we censor facts when inconvenient, all while totally ignoring how we got here. Manufacturers just can't make enough cars. And sometimes the cars they make get burned up on a cargo ship in the middle of the ocean.

Nissan set a fair MSRP on the new Z. If they could make enough, we'd be negotiating from MSRP. They can't.

So, next time you get mad at someone for not wearing a facemask, or a dealer marking up a vehicle in tight supply, get mad at China for fucking putting us in dystopia world, stop getting mad at people who didn't create the damn problem.

Facts!

 

[fliplover]

The supply thing is 100% not artificial. This kind of profit pocketing used to only apply to specialty vehicle but currently it's just about everything. Pathfinders are on a 3-4 month wait, Rogues are 2 months, Sentras are spotty availability or 1 month along with Altimas. Had a guy who traded an F150 with 25k miles he bought new in 2020 and he got 6k more than what he paid for it.

I work for a company that sells and services equipment made in both Japan and Germany. There is nothing artificial about the material supply shortages right now. Equipment that used to be manufactured in 12-14 weeks from the time a production order is generated is now taking 24 or more weeks because some of the critical parts are simply not available.

 

[McLovin157]

I work for a company that sells and services equipment made in both Japan and Germany. There is nothing artificial about the material supply shortages right now. Equipment that used to be manufactured in 12-14 weeks from the time a production order is generated is now taking 24 or more weeks because some of the critical parts are simply not available.

At this point I wish it was all fake but we know that this is the world we live in right now ?

 

[White_turbo]

The supply thing is 100% not artificial.

I said demand not supply. I understand the supply issue currently with this whole pandemic crap. But let's forget about the craziness in the last two years, the ADM is still very real for certain cars in the absence of any supply chain issue.

When I say demand is artificial, I simply mean people are willing to pay ADM just to be the first ones to have the new shiny thing that temporarily drive up the demand and allow dealers to mark them up for whatever they see fit. For a typical car that isn't limited in production number, there is simply not enough demand for the ADM to be sustainable in the long term.

Let's say you put a $10k markup on a brand new 370z right now, you aren't getting it sold guaranteed.

 

[McLovin157]

I said demand not supply. I understand the supply issue currently with this whole pandemic crap. But let's forget about the craziness in the last two years, the ADM is still very real in the absence of any supply chain issue.

The demand issue is also a very real thing. The cars people want/need hasn't dropped in fact it continues to get worse.

 

[takemorepills]

I said demand not supply. I understand the supply issue currently with this whole pandemic crap. But let's forget about the craziness in the last two years, the ADM is still very real for certain cars in the absence of any supply chain issue.

When I say demand is artificial, I simply mean people are willing to pay ADM just to be the first ones to have the new shiny thing that temporarily drive up the demand and allow dealers to mark them up for whatever they see fit. For a typical car that isn't limited in production number, there is simply not enough demand for the ADM to be sustainable in the long term.

Let's say you put a $10k markup on a brand new 370z right now, you aren't getting it sold guaranteed.

Honda CTR was intentionally kept in short supply by Honda, guaranteeing that few would go for less than MSRP. That was a shitty move by Honda.

 

[White_turbo]

An interesting point I would also like to throw out to everyone here. There has been bragging about paying under MSRP so the two question I propose is.

If dealers are evil for charging over MSRP why is it victorious for individuals to get less than MSRP?
Why is it ok for an individual to buy at MSRP and sell at a crazy mark up but not a dealership?

If a total online model is adopted then there will never be a deal done under MSRP it will be like buying anything. No special deals for buying x number of cars at a location or being a loyal service customer. You will just pay what the manufacturer decides the price should be. There will be no going over features, or hands on coaching on what a vehicle does they will just be online videos. I by no means am saying the dealer model is perfect or efficient. Though I do enjoy a more personal experience and that is impossible to attain by doing everything online or on a "dealer" tablet.

A heavy topic that will get super heated but one I'm curious what others think.

Because we all know even at MSRP, there is enough kick back/incentives etc. from the manufacturer to allow dealers to make money. Honestly, I will be ok with having the manufacturer set the price and that is the price I will pay and not have to deal with the numbers playing with dealer.

What "personal experience" do a car salesman provide? Serious question. I think is a win if I can walk out of the dealership with a car without having them jerking you around with number game and actually being transparent with the charges and not try to hide them.

I asked you what you would say to me if I am cross shopping between a MKV Supra and the Z. You gave me a bunch of information that isn't something that I don't know already, so what other personal experience should I be expecting?

 

[siggy]

An interesting point I would also like to throw out to everyone here. There has been bragging about paying under MSRP so the two question I propose is.

If dealers are evil for charging over MSRP why is it victorious for individuals to get less than MSRP?
Why is it ok for an individual to buy at MSRP and sell at a crazy mark up but not a dealership?

If a total online model is adopted then there will never be a deal done under MSRP it will be like buying anything. No special deals for buying x number of cars at a location or being a loyal service customer. You will just pay what the manufacturer decides the price should be. There will be no going over features, or hands on coaching on what a vehicle does they will just be online videos. I by no means am saying the dealer model is perfect or efficient. Though I do enjoy a more personal experience and that is impossible to attain by doing everything online or on a "dealer" tablet.

A heavy topic that will get super heated but one I'm curious what others think.

I like it! Valid questions!

For me it's just about transparency. If a dealer says $5k ADM, $300 doc fee, and that's it. Cool. But if you say that, and then they say we need carpet protection, nitrogen, etc. +2k AFTER you negotiated a price, that's what sets me to another level. Or you negotiate a price and then he salesperson starts talking about monthly payments. That's another one that makes me get the pimp powder out. Then there are dealers who let you order a vehicle at MSRP, and once it arrives they tack on a $20k ADM. Those hopefully are the ones that will go out of business once things turn around. To me it's the shady part of the business that's super frustrating. But if you're honest about your pricing, and if that is your dealership is charging x amount of ADM, then that's alright in my book. Kudos to you for putting your neck out there!

 

[siggy]

I asked you what you would say to me if I am cross shopping between a MKV Supra and the Z. You gave me a bunch of information that isn't something that I don't know already, so what other personal experience should I be expecting?

I mean what were you expecting? A happy ending? That's about all he can do and of course let you test drive it. If he's informed about the product he's selling, he's ahead of 95% of salespersons.

 

[White_turbo]

I mean what were you expecting? A happy ending? That's about all he can do and of course let you test drive it. If he's informed about the product he's selling, he's ahead of 95% of salespersons.

Yeah. A happy ending would let me justify paying ADM. Has to be a hot female saleswoman though.

And that is my point. He said he prefer a more personal experience over online dealing. My question is what does that even mean? I am just there to buy a car.